need clarification on rule change at penis bot

[security_man]

not sure if they are active or not here but maybe you guys can clarify their new rules if they arent around to give it to me from the horses mouth

as of the 27th of jan their rules state:

You must submit the index or warning page of your site in "Site URL" field.
Our reciprocal link must be placed on visible place, above "enter" link if you place it on index page.
We do not list sites submited only to us. Your site must be submited and accepted at least in one another link site.

does that mean only the index.html page (folder default) or do you think that means just an index page that could be mirrored?

[stuveltje]

lol sec_man just submit real index and your be save!!! lo, Beef just find out, she submitted an warning and didnt get thru, index.html will do

[security_man]

wtf is the point of doing that? i mean its not going to help link pop, not going to make sure they get listed on the same page as the big boys, i mean all its doing is making submitters build mirrored folders for each site with only the index.html page in them. it just doesnt make sense to me - someone please explain before i loose my mind

[stuveltje]

mmmmm i dont see a problem you sound like beef a bit, hell just make some folders copie and you have what 5 index pages, ??? i still think more linksites will ask real index pages in furture, and dont think a nuthad is answering you.........you know bette that that...........

[security_man]

yeah ive noticed that alot of linklists are doing this, thats why i want to know why. it is a pain in the ass to do it this way - i have to change a fucking million templates and recode the macro that does my se terms - i can do it but why the fuck should i if no one is getting a benifit from it. makes me want to tell penis bot to fuck off and just stop submitting to them

[stuveltje]

hahahaha sec_man, i have heard beef telling me that this evening, but i dont see the probem, go wth the flowwwwwwwww, bizz is changing................

[security_man]

because its stupid.

unless there is a reason to do it that i cant think of then they are just making a rule for the sake of making a rule and thats just plain stupid imho

i dont have a problem changing when there is a reason to - niche specific recips are a perfect example, but if there isnt a reason then i dont want to waste my time conforming the way i do things to the whims and fancies of every linklist owner on the net.

am i crazy to think that way? i dunno, but thats why im asking...
why
are they changing their rules?

[stuveltje]

i dont know.........maybe because its getting a bit harder this year? low dollar i get the shit of the dollar i get what 16 euro of every 35 dollar i make, hell that sucks huge........but thats bizz, all are trying to survive?????? visa change and all??? i dont know, i just go with the flow, i can naggg......it wont make me money .......work thats what makes me money, bizz change alot its not the same as 6 years ago, i heard stories(wich i love , you could make tons of money with one free site 6 years ago) do i regret i wasnt there 6 years ago, no i wont.........i choose this bizz almost 3 years ago and i go with the flow, alot of changes monthy, changing sponsor links and all, i am getting sick of it, but i still work and change............... they have their reason, i dont care they dont have to tell me........i just go with the flowwwwwww

[Bill]

Sec_man, basically they are saying they are big enough that they shouldn't have to be placed on mirrored pages. And they are right.

Mirrored pages are only good for the smaller linklists, if you do them at all.

[security_man]

Originally posted by Bill
Mirrored pages are only good for the smaller linklists, if you do them at all.

why do you say that? i have always put greenguy and richard and smut gremlin and many others on mirror pages - if penis bot is wanting to be listed with them then they need to say that. i dont list any big linklists on my index.html mirror (no offence to any listed on my index.html page LOL)

like i said before all you have to do is make mirrored folders and you bypass that whole issue, it just seems counter productive imho

[Bill]

Well there are several issues here, but the most important is optimizing for google and the benefits of the index page in google. All other things being equal, google tends to rank index pages higher, and regard them as more valuable.

Just because Greenguy and Smutgremlins are damn nice folks and will give you a listing from a mirrored page doesn't make it optimum. Penisbot is trying to come in from behind, their whole strategy is to optimize for google, so they are wisely saying don't put us on mirrored pages please.

Now me, I don't mirror pages at all, nor do I submit to the hundreds a little link lists. It's a waste of time and money. Building a free site that has a chance of doing well in google is better in terms of total earning for that free site in the long run.

I said this once on Greenys old message board about 3 years ago, and every little link list owner jumped down my throat bitching me out. Only two of those guys are still here and in business, and one dosn't own little linklists any longer, because they are too much trouble, not enough profit.

A free site with a bunch of nearly identical mirrored pages looks like a doorway site to google, and it will tend to get devalued.

[DangerDave]

Bill,

having made that argument countless times on many boards... you are "beating a dead horse"..

For some reason they simply dont want to listen to valid arguments..

I too never build mirrors, and only submit to a select list of linklists

DD

[xxxjay]

Originally posted by DangerDave
Bill,

having made that argument countless times on many boards... you are "beating a dead horse"..

For some reason they simply dont want to listen to valid arguments..

I too never build mirrors, and only submit to a select list of linklists

DD

I agree. Pick 16-20 solid linklist that you know you get listed at. Get to know the owners. Not making a bunch of subfolders is also good for SE traffic

[MrMaryLou]

If you do your mirrors right every one can be on the index

[Cleo]

I don't submit to a real lot of links lists but I do submit to more then just the really big ones and do very well with sales from some of the smaller list, often better then I do off of the larger lists.

PenisBot has a really great spot for porn over at Google so I guess they can pretty much ask for whatever kind of recip they want.

But in the end isn't it really about getting and listing good sites with good design and content that the surfer wants to see?

[security_man]

thats kindof what i am asking cleo, how much difference in googles eyes is there between the index of four or five mirrored folders index pages and four or five mirrored warning pages?

im not disputing whether or not they can do what they did, im trying to figure out what good its going to do me. not to sound selfish but thats the only reason i take the time to submit to any linklist in the first place, yknow?

when megaporn links put up the rule that they wanted to be listed with at least three of a list of 8 or so it made sense cuz i got something out of it - this seems to be alot of work for very little gain.

that is why i am asking tho, i dont know and i am wondering if it will benefit me by making mirrored folders vs mirrored warning pages.

[Surfn]

I don't mirror for LL's.

I do for TGP's

[Bill]

I guess you must have some strategy I don't yet understand for your index pages, because for the life of me I can't understand why anyone would want to deny their best index page for penisbot quality traffic and linking.

There are about a dozen sites that will send 95% of the total traffic your site will see from linklists. why they shouldn't be linked on your index is a mystery to me. Most pass on decent pr and while they don't always seem to be a big help in search engine positioning they don't hurt.

I still tend to reserve the root index of my domains for a search engine strategy that usually keeps me from putting link list links on the root index. But I'm planning to do more of that, link list linking to roots, in the future. Just to get more measurements on what effect it has.

[security_man]

im not talking abuot the root index of my domains im talking about the root index of my free sites which are all subfolders of the root domain - thats why im confused as to the benefits.

as to a strategy, kindof - the only linklists i put on my index are the ones who allow popups, fpas before content, and pics on html. if that page does do better in se placement i want to make sure that i can convert the traffic as effectively as i can with the tools i have availible to me. i sure as hell dont want a site that conforms to penisbots rules in a good se spot - im not looking for bookmarkers, yknow?

as to passing on decent pr, sure, and they would pass on a decent pr to any mirror page i submit to them. like i said if they wanted to be listed with all the big linklists then ask for that like mega porn links did - his rule at least gave me some kind of benefit.

again - im not lambasting them for changing their rules, ultimately its their choice and i can always just not submit to them, but i would like to at least understand what their reasoning was

[Cleo]

All of my warning pages are index pages. Non are fake and non are anymore real then any others.

I find my biggest expense is content so I build a lot of stuff out of each set that I buy and I don't reuse it.

I give PenisBot a good recip on a page that has other large lists on it and build clean sites with fresh content that are easy to navigate and try to make each one unique, I never reuse a design without tweaking it first.

I get good listings so I'm happy and I guess I guess the places that I submit to are happy seeing as they list my stuff.

It is pretty amazing that Penisbot is number one for porn over at Google so they are doing something right.

[Bill]

Yes, well that clarifies things. That reason makes perfect sense to me, in fact I do something like it at times myself.

I've built two versions of many sites, on two seperate folders, one with dmoz grade advertising (a console and a fpa), one with the fussier linklist grade advertising.

Neither consoles or fpas are as efficient sales tools as they once were, so I do it less these days. You have to build variations between the two sites or google will tend to devalue them, thats the reason I don't do it so often these days, better to concentrate my work on one optimized site. (and dmoz isn't so important these days.

Anyway, that is a decent reason to want to conserve an index.

[KCat]

I don't bother with mirrors at all. I submit to 8 or so LLs out of a list of about 20 so that every free site doesn't have the exact same links. Trying to be more random seems to be helping with SEO. Plus I don't have the trouble getting listed some people complain about.

[kit]

Hello guys!
We decided to add this rule after close exploring of submitting results for doorway pages with "enter.html , warning.html , etc." at the end or URL. Nobody list em among big LL's like:
Link-o-Rama
Richards-Realm
Tommys-Bookmarks
MegaPornLinks
PK
Hoes
DD

They are not list those sites. And we decided don't list em too. I'm not sure, this is 100% rule in LL's mentioned above, but at least 90%.

[security_man]

okay, if the reason to make the rule is to be on the page with big linklists then do it like mega porn links did and ask to be with them. right now if i submit the mirror page with the big boys on it to you then you will reject it. if i submit the index.html page to you the big boys arent on it at all so you will prolly reject it too.

im in a catch 22 here - and thats why i wanted the clarification. if i submit warning.html to you with all the "big boys" on it even though its not index.html will you list me or reject me?

[security_man]

the other problem is that your rules arent the same as greenguy, richard, mega pornl inks, jaysXXX and the rest. they allow pics on html pages and you dont so i will never be able to put you on the same mirror as them.

if your going to demand to be put on the same page as other linklists please dont tie my hands by making your rules more strict than them... cuz now i have to decide if being listed on your site is more important than the ad space i get on html pages that full sized pics are on which all of them allow.