A rant about "approved" recips

Pagan · 2009-01-24, 05:55 PM

<rant>
I don't get it. A reciprocal link should be a very straightforward thing, but it gets more complex each day. Years back, the lists required their graphic be used as the anchor. Then it moved on to category recips and custom tables. I can appreciate it to a degree, but... there is no uniformity and fairness to the recips. I mean, they are important, yes, but are they the most important thing on the page?

When I came back to this business last June, it was still graphic buttons and/or tables. It seems the smaller the link list, the larger, brighter, more attention grabbing the recip had to be. Then I started doing custom recips because most sites allowed it, and it looked so much nicer. I do care what my index pages look like, and don't want anything distracting my visitor from my sponsor banner. After all, I build the site to drive the visitor to the paysite and not to a busy collection of jumping graphics and scrolling marquees. Examples - Old school site specified and the "cleaned up" version of this same site. That example isn't the best, but it is one of the few I have remaining of the old type. I also moved to the custom recip table because I could list more recips much neater than the old way. Instead of a dozen mirrors, I now can do only 5 or 6 and submit to the same number of sites.

Don't misunderstand me here - I do truly appreciate the sites I submit to as well as their requirements for visibility. I am always happy to do the link back because it's almost like a seal of quality. However, I don't build sites for reciprocal links. I know some sites don't require category recips, but most still do, and to be fair to everyone I do them on all of my recip tables. I also use the title tag to blast that link list message out.

At the same time, there is now a trend away from the simple link list name and category recip towards 5 and 6 line text-tables. I don't mind adding in a line of promotional stuff, but, make it optional to the designer, please! I also see sites that expect us to use their blind links (OnlyBestSex, Momma's Pussy along with others are the bigger ones that are always mentioned in the rejection threads).

Today was disturbing. A site I have been subbing to consistently now has a requirement in that I use their 150 pixel wide table with scrolling text. Need I mention that there was no option given to change the color? While the colors would have worked for the site I am submitting today, it would have been a horrible clash for the other one I have to submit. It has to be that table and exactly that table and even when I tried duplicating it, marquee and anchor text, I was still blocked from submitting. And... why should they get 150 pixels when others only ask for 100 pixels wide? Sadly, I have pulled them from my recip table and replaced them with another list that isn't so.. stiff.

I know subs are down in some respects and we have a whole influx of rather clueless noobies, but... this is a little ridiculous, don't you think? Do you link list owners really get that much traffic from the linked freesites that you have to have entire paragraphs written about your list or decline to list a site because it won't use your blind-linked table?

Thanks for letting me rant....
</rant>

Bill · 2009-01-24, 05:59 PM

Don't put up with it.

Believe me their traffic is shit anyway.

And the sites with decent traffic won't mess with your head if you just give them the same type of text recip you are giving the other guys.

It's time free site builders said fuckyou to all the little tyrants with big egoes and little traffic.

SheepGuy · 2009-01-24, 06:48 PM

Bill hits the nail right on the head, as usual.
Take a look at the traffic the dictatorial demanding sites send, and compare it to the traffic the mellower "live and let live" sites send.
Ah-Ha! Eureka! The truth is in the numbers.

Cleo · 2009-01-24, 08:48 PM

My personal pet peeve is requiring the use of a category recip. Sometimes it seems like I spending more time hunting down and changing out recips to the correct category than in building the promotional piece.

NY Jester · 2009-01-24, 09:05 PM

I have to agree Cleo. Thats my biggest pet peeve as well. I am happily surprised when I see my link done with a category link as well, but I think its all well and good to just have a general link.

Cleo · 2009-01-24, 09:09 PM

Even worse is PenisBot that has an image as well as text that is category specific.

HowlingWulf · 2009-01-24, 10:00 PM

Penisbot does offer text only cat recips, you have to scroll down to see it.

Sven800 · 2009-01-24, 10:10 PM

I'll take a non-category text link any day.

bDok · 2009-01-25, 01:16 AM

yea i'm happy with 1. to see my recip on a decent looking site. 2. my site listed with a bunch of other sites that actually review and add the site.

number 2 doesn't even need to really happen. I'm happy to have a decent looking freesite that follows the rules and has one of my general recip or some text recip with my site name. lol

LD · 2009-01-25, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cleo

My personal pet peeve is requiring the use of a category recip. Sometimes it seems like I spending more time hunting down and changing out recips to the correct category than in building the promotional piece.

Yeah...I've seriously considered only submitting to list that do not require cat receipts, with a few notable exceptions, of course. I wish there were a list somewhere (there might be) of list that do not require cat receipts. I would certainly give them priority over the others.

ladydesigner · 2009-01-25, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LusciousDelight

Yeah...I've seriously considered only submitting to list that do not require cat receipts, with a few notable exceptions, of course.

Same here! In fact, I'm building a site right now and am spending more time getting the correct category recips for those that require them than I spent building the whole site. Gets very boring and makes my eyes cross.

Sven800 · 2009-01-25, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ladydesigner

Same here! In fact, I'm building a site right now and am spending more time getting the correct category recips for those that require them than I spent building the whole site. Gets very boring and makes my eyes cross.

Main reason why i have not been able to bring myself to build a site in a couple of months.

Everyone gets pissed when I submit sites to the same 2 or 3 categories... There is a reason for that - it means I don't have to go digging for category recips all the damn time.

Pagan · 2009-01-25, 03:51 PM

Doing Category recips is really not all that bad. It lets me see where I think my site will fit in best. Mine will often fit two or three categories, and if one is quite full, I can pick another. Or, the LL might not have that category. I don't ever object to category recips. I think it is a guide for the visitors to know where to look to find other sites of a similar flavor. I also do it out of fairness. A recip that is 1 line in a table of 2-3 lines looks odd or unfinished. I am actually proud to show where my sites are listed. Go figure.

Where I do have problems with it is when it is applied with the iron fist. A lot of my sites tell a story. On an anal site for example, I include some of the foreplay but still make sure that 50% of each gallery is specific to the niche. If it's a reality based site, you need some of the story line to enjoy the site as a whole. The paysites include it, and may well feature it highly in their tours. Yet, I have had sites declined because though I had one category recip, they felt it was really a different category. The sites were accepted at 90% of the other lists on that recip table. The decline wasn't for structure - it was over a category recip.

I know, too, that without some standard a few of the freesite builders will put your recip in 4 point dark grey text on a black background. But, how rigid do you LL owners feel you need to be on your recips? Do you really feel we need to take a step backwards after the LOR Trusted Submitter changes?

plateman · 2009-01-25, 03:53 PM

I've said on my of these type threads that I would take both recips

the category ones I have or just a link to my index

and if other LL's insist on there category recips with crazy rules for them, then I'd forget about those LL's

Sven800 · 2009-01-25, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pagan

I know, too, that without some standard a few of the freesite builders will put your recip in 4 point dark grey text on a black background. But, how rigid do you LL owners feel you need to be on your recips? Do you really feel we need to take a step backwards after the LOR Trusted Submitter changes?

If my recip is hard to read I will not list the site. If you have a black background make sure my text isn't black. If I can not read my recip I am assuming you don't want it listed on my site.

MeatPounder · 2009-01-25, 10:31 PM

Recips were always a sore spot with me.
For awhile there every list made their buttons gaudier and gaudier trying to become the focal point of every free site landing page.
Free sites started looking like carnival sites...and ugly as hell. Each button had to be bigger and more attention grabbing than the next, style went out the door.

Then the value of text links came into vogue, and many rushed to have paragraphs of text in their recips...bold marques blurting out LOOK AT ME!!!!

Then link lists started demanding WHO they were on the page with (not all but some even here from GG&J members) It became commonplace in the rules to see link lists demanding all their fellow recips on the free site had to be PR4 , or if they were on the page their other sites or partners sites had to be on the page too (hell several had 3-4 different linklists in their own recips!)

Then damn it all came the categories, every link list had several dozen (if not more) cats and they wanted the recips to point to the specific category...recip tables became a nightmare....if you submited to a dozen or more niches, you had to have 25-40 recip tables at the minimum...lol)
This is all not to mention specific fonts and table dimensions and text colors in the recips and trying to get that all to work with your design.

I finally got to the point of going all custom text recips...nice ones with keywords specific to the individual link lists.

If a link list accepted that, I submitted, if they didn't I crossed them off my submit list and moved on (no matter how good their traffic was)

After all, the freesite is my sales tool...and within reason I design them to make sales not to be listed. Being listed is not my primary purpose in creating a site, earning money is.
And I've found most link list owners will accept a well designed free site that follows reasonable rules

Maj. Stress · 2009-01-26, 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MeatPounder

I finally got to the point of going all custom text recips...nice ones with keywords specific to the individual link lists.

If a link list accepted that, I submitted, if they didn't I crossed them off my submit list and moved on (no matter how good their traffic was)

After all, the freesite is my sales tool...and within reason I design them to make sales not to be listed. Being listed is not my primary purpose in creating a site, earning money is.
And I've found most link list owners will accept a well designed free site that follows reasonable rules

Maya · 2009-01-26, 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MeatPounder

I finally got to the point of going all custom text recips...nice ones with keywords specific to the individual link lists.

If a link list accepted that, I submitted, if they didn't I crossed them off my submit list and moved on (no matter how good their traffic was)

Excactly the way I've been doing it the last 6 months or more, and actually only had to remove very few LL's because of that

Sven800 · 2009-01-26, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maya

Excactly the way I've been doing it the last 6 months or more, and actually only had to remove very few LL's because of that

Care to send me a list?

stuveltje · 2009-01-26, 02:51 PM

you can nag what you want about those receips, but its still your choise if you wanna take the afford to make the receips like they want to submit to their page, its your choise, not theirs, dont wanna do it, then dont, nobody forche you....dont like the change , remove them from your submit list and move on....heheh and yes i can say that because i was a submitter ones too and i hated to change the receip also all the time, because this is not something which is invented the last months....but i choose to not submit and do the afford (of how the hell you say that), also there is nothing wrong with telling your pet peeve.....but what result do you expect from it?....just move one with your biss

Maya · 2009-01-26, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sven800

Care to send me a list?

Re-reading MeatPounders post, I realize that he might mean using only one link per LL, and in that case, thats not the excact way I do it

I do make category specific recips for all lists except those who ask for a certain general recip. (Sample)
I sometimes simply take out half a day to go through my entire list of LL's and get the recips for new categorys I want to test, and sort them into tables.
It takes time, but it's worth it I think... I now have ready tables for 11 or 12 different categories for about 80 LLs - all custom made.
So more or less whatever I feel like making, I have recips for it

But I do only use these custom ones, and never with more than 2 links, and always only link to one domain within a recip. And this is what most LL's have accepted

Nymph · 2009-01-26, 04:27 PM

Coming into this with much caution since I do run different LinkLists.

On my main LL, I have 3 different ways to recip. Warning, main, or category. My other 2 are niche specific, and can be reciped to either warning, main, or main linklist. All are either a button, or simple text links. It's the submitters choice.

On my TGPs, I do use a small table with my colors, font, and text size.

Now, in defense of some of the other LL owners out there.....
Doing our recips in tables, using our specified colors makes sure our link can be seen. Too many times I have checked for a recip on a submitted site, and with the colors they use either for background, text, links, or visited links, you may, or may not be able to see the recip. I don't know if it's an accident, or possibly done on purpose, but at any rate, it's not right.

Just like you as a submitter get upset about all the different rules, we as LL owners get upset about the not so honest submitters that try to pull a fast one on us. If it wasn't for the dishonest submitters, and cheats, then we wouldn't have to have some of the rules, and ways of reciping that we do. It's a pain in the tush for all of us.

Pagan · 2009-01-26, 07:37 PM

Meatpounder hit it on the nose for me. He has gone through so much of what I didn't express. If a list is going to deny a site ONLY because of the type of recip - no other reason at all - then who is the real loser? Not me - I do have other LLs to use. But, if your new rules are turning away decent site builders who honor every single other rule you have - the kind that don't change their sites without telling you, never change your recip text to invisible text, and otherwise treat you well - maybe we need to rethink this game? (yes, I now have a little LL too!)

I really hated to delete the LL that rejected me this week - I have been subbing to them for the last 6 months nice and steady, and been accepted all this time with no problems at all. But... like Stu says so often, business is business. I won't name the list, or ask for changes. I started this thread in the hopes of not losing other lists that I enjoy submitting to. Odd, but I really enjoy torturing all you LL owners with my humble submits, and I love the day after I submit a site and get all the acceptance messages.

2009-01-24, 05:55 PM	#1
Pagan Perverted Empress Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 4,692	A rant about "approved" recips <rant> I don't get it. A reciprocal link should be a very straightforward thing, but it gets more complex each day. Years back, the lists required their graphic be used as the anchor. Then it moved on to category recips and custom tables. I can appreciate it to a degree, but... there is no uniformity and fairness to the recips. I mean, they are important, yes, but are they the most important thing on the page? When I came back to this business last June, it was still graphic buttons and/or tables. It seems the smaller the link list, the larger, brighter, more attention grabbing the recip had to be. Then I started doing custom recips because most sites allowed it, and it looked so much nicer. I do care what my index pages look like, and don't want anything distracting my visitor from my sponsor banner. After all, I build the site to drive the visitor to the paysite and not to a busy collection of jumping graphics and scrolling marquees. Examples - Old school site specified and the "cleaned up" version of this same site. That example isn't the best, but it is one of the few I have remaining of the old type. I also moved to the custom recip table because I could list more recips much neater than the old way. Instead of a dozen mirrors, I now can do only 5 or 6 and submit to the same number of sites. Don't misunderstand me here - I do truly appreciate the sites I submit to as well as their requirements for visibility. I am always happy to do the link back because it's almost like a seal of quality. However, I don't build sites for reciprocal links. I know some sites don't require category recips, but most still do, and to be fair to everyone I do them on all of my recip tables. I also use the title tag to blast that link list message out. At the same time, there is now a trend away from the simple link list name and category recip towards 5 and 6 line text-tables. I don't mind adding in a line of promotional stuff, but, make it optional to the designer, please! I also see sites that expect us to use their blind links (OnlyBestSex, Momma's Pussy along with others are the bigger ones that are always mentioned in the rejection threads). Today was disturbing. A site I have been subbing to consistently now has a requirement in that I use their 150 pixel wide table with scrolling text. Need I mention that there was no option given to change the color? While the colors would have worked for the site I am submitting today, it would have been a horrible clash for the other one I have to submit. It has to be that table and exactly that table and even when I tried duplicating it, marquee and anchor text, I was still blocked from submitting. And... why should they get 150 pixels when others only ask for 100 pixels wide? Sadly, I have pulled them from my recip table and replaced them with another list that isn't so.. stiff. I know subs are down in some respects and we have a whole influx of rather clueless noobies, but... this is a little ridiculous, don't you think? Do you link list owners really get that much traffic from the linked freesites that you have to have entire paragraphs written about your list or decline to list a site because it won't use your blind-linked table? Thanks for letting me rant.... </rant> __________________ So, who sprinkled all that Bitchy dust?

2009-01-24, 06:48 PM	#3
SheepGuy It's the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 2,527	Bill hits the nail right on the head, as usual. Take a look at the traffic the dictatorial demanding sites send, and compare it to the traffic the mellower "live and let live" sites send. Ah-Ha! Eureka! The truth is in the numbers. __________________ If the Environment was a bank, they would have saved it by now.

2009-01-24, 08:48 PM	#4
Cleo Subversive filth of the hedonistic decadent West Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Southeast Florida Posts: 27,936	My personal pet peeve is requiring the use of a category recip. Sometimes it seems like I spending more time hunting down and changing out recips to the correct category than in building the promotional piece. __________________ Free Rides on Uber and Lyft Uber Car: uberTzTerri Lyft Car: TZ896289

2009-01-24, 09:05 PM	#5
NY Jester ICQ:147079406 Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: RockMEHardplace Posts: 2,996	I have to agree Cleo. Thats my biggest pet peeve as well. I am happily surprised when I see my link done with a category link as well, but I think its all well and good to just have a general link. __________________ The Sexy Side of Porn

2009-01-24, 09:09 PM	#6
Cleo Subversive filth of the hedonistic decadent West Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Southeast Florida Posts: 27,936	Even worse is PenisBot that has an image as well as text that is category specific. __________________ Free Rides on Uber and Lyft Uber Car: uberTzTerri Lyft Car: TZ896289

2009-01-24, 05:59 PM	#2
Bill Selling porn allows me to stay in a constant state of Bliss - ain't that a trip! Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 3,914	Don't put up with it. Believe me their traffic is shit anyway. And the sites with decent traffic won't mess with your head if you just give them the same type of text recip you are giving the other guys. It's time free site builders said fuckyou to all the little tyrants with big egoes and little traffic.

2009-01-24, 10:00 PM	#7
HowlingWulf Me fail English? That's unpossible! Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: FL Posts: 1,381	Penisbot does offer text only cat recips, you have to scroll down to see it. __________________ WordPress Porn directory theme => Maddos Create a Porn Tube => Video Pornster

2009-01-24, 10:10 PM	#8
Sven800 No matter how good you are at something, there's always about a million people better than you Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 230	I'll take a non-category text link any day. __________________ PornoXP XXX Adult Free - Now taking submissions

2009-01-25, 01:16 AM	#9
bDok bang bang Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: SD/OC/LA Posts: 3,241	yea i'm happy with 1. to see my recip on a decent looking site. 2. my site listed with a bunch of other sites that actually review and add the site. number 2 doesn't even need to really happen. I'm happy to have a decent looking freesite that follows the rules and has one of my general recip or some text recip with my site name. lol __________________ submit to Nymphotic submit to Moistlace

2009-01-25, 03:51 PM	#13
Pagan Perverted Empress Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 4,692	Doing Category recips is really not all that bad. It lets me see where I think my site will fit in best. Mine will often fit two or three categories, and if one is quite full, I can pick another. Or, the LL might not have that category. I don't ever object to category recips. I think it is a guide for the visitors to know where to look to find other sites of a similar flavor. I also do it out of fairness. A recip that is 1 line in a table of 2-3 lines looks odd or unfinished. I am actually proud to show where my sites are listed. Go figure. Where I do have problems with it is when it is applied with the iron fist. A lot of my sites tell a story. On an anal site for example, I include some of the foreplay but still make sure that 50% of each gallery is specific to the niche. If it's a reality based site, you need some of the story line to enjoy the site as a whole. The paysites include it, and may well feature it highly in their tours. Yet, I have had sites declined because though I had one category recip, they felt it was really a different category. The sites were accepted at 90% of the other lists on that recip table. The decline wasn't for structure - it was over a category recip. I know, too, that without some standard a few of the freesite builders will put your recip in 4 point dark grey text on a black background. But, how rigid do you LL owners feel you need to be on your recips? Do you really feel we need to take a step backwards after the LOR Trusted Submitter changes? __________________ So, who sprinkled all that Bitchy dust?

2009-01-25, 03:53 PM	#14
plateman What can I do - I was born this way LOL Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: ohio Posts: 3,086	I've said on my of these type threads that I would take both recips the category ones I have or just a link to my index and if other LL's insist on there category recips with crazy rules for them, then I'd forget about those LL's __________________ Submit to: Porn O Plenty XXX Links Reality Here

2009-01-25, 10:31 PM	#16
MeatPounder Women might be able to fake orgasms But men can fake whole relationships Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Fort Lauderdale, Fl Posts: 2,408	Recips were always a sore spot with me. For awhile there every list made their buttons gaudier and gaudier trying to become the focal point of every free site landing page. Free sites started looking like carnival sites...and ugly as hell. Each button had to be bigger and more attention grabbing than the next, style went out the door. Then the value of text links came into vogue, and many rushed to have paragraphs of text in their recips...bold marques blurting out LOOK AT ME!!!! Then link lists started demanding WHO they were on the page with (not all but some even here from GG&J members) It became commonplace in the rules to see link lists demanding all their fellow recips on the free site had to be PR4 , or if they were on the page their other sites or partners sites had to be on the page too (hell several had 3-4 different linklists in their own recips!) Then damn it all came the categories, every link list had several dozen (if not more) cats and they wanted the recips to point to the specific category...recip tables became a nightmare....if you submited to a dozen or more niches, you had to have 25-40 recip tables at the minimum...lol) This is all not to mention specific fonts and table dimensions and text colors in the recips and trying to get that all to work with your design. I finally got to the point of going all custom text recips...nice ones with keywords specific to the individual link lists. If a link list accepted that, I submitted, if they didn't I crossed them off my submit list and moved on (no matter how good their traffic was) After all, the freesite is my sales tool...and within reason I design them to make sales not to be listed. Being listed is not my primary purpose in creating a site, earning money is. And I've found most link list owners will accept a well designed free site that follows reasonable rules

2009-01-26, 02:51 PM	#20
stuveltje Live and learn. And take very careful notes! Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Sunny Holland Posts: 6,157	you can nag what you want about those receips, but its still your choise if you wanna take the afford to make the receips like they want to submit to their page, its your choise, not theirs, dont wanna do it, then dont, nobody forche you....dont like the change , remove them from your submit list and move on....heheh and yes i can say that because i was a submitter ones too and i hated to change the receip also all the time, because this is not something which is invented the last months....but i choose to not submit and do the afford (of how the hell you say that), also there is nothing wrong with telling your pet peeve.....but what result do you expect from it?....just move one with your biss __________________ Canadian Sexlinks - submit Erotica search -submit

2009-01-26, 04:27 PM	#22
Nymph Get me! Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Lower Alabama-The Redneck Riviera Posts: 677	Coming into this with much caution since I do run different LinkLists. On my main LL, I have 3 different ways to recip. Warning, main, or category. My other 2 are niche specific, and can be reciped to either warning, main, or main linklist. All are either a button, or simple text links. It's the submitters choice. On my TGPs, I do use a small table with my colors, font, and text size. Now, in defense of some of the other LL owners out there..... Doing our recips in tables, using our specified colors makes sure our link can be seen. Too many times I have checked for a recip on a submitted site, and with the colors they use either for background, text, links, or visited links, you may, or may not be able to see the recip. I don't know if it's an accident, or possibly done on purpose, but at any rate, it's not right. Just like you as a submitter get upset about all the different rules, we as LL owners get upset about the not so honest submitters that try to pull a fast one on us. If it wasn't for the dishonest submitters, and cheats, then we wouldn't have to have some of the rules, and ways of reciping that we do. It's a pain in the tush for all of us.

2009-01-26, 07:37 PM	#23
Pagan Perverted Empress Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 4,692	Meatpounder hit it on the nose for me. He has gone through so much of what I didn't express. If a list is going to deny a site ONLY because of the type of recip - no other reason at all - then who is the real loser? Not me - I do have other LLs to use. But, if your new rules are turning away decent site builders who honor every single other rule you have - the kind that don't change their sites without telling you, never change your recip text to invisible text, and otherwise treat you well - maybe we need to rethink this game? (yes, I now have a little LL too!) I really hated to delete the LL that rejected me this week - I have been subbing to them for the last 6 months nice and steady, and been accepted all this time with no problems at all. But... like Stu says so often, business is business. I won't name the list, or ask for changes. I started this thread in the hopes of not losing other lists that I enjoy submitting to. Odd, but I really enjoy torturing all you LL owners with my humble submits, and I love the day after I submit a site and get all the acceptance messages. __________________ So, who sprinkled all that Bitchy dust?