the future of tgps and link lists (maybe)

[PayAsYouClick]

Originally Posted by Barron

Disclaimer: I am signing up for this for a project of mine. I like this concept.

However, the operative phrase is "smart webmaster".

I say this only as a heads up:
Cheryl is quite the sales person. She has the ability to put the right disclaimers in just the right spots in every post. This is not a bad thing or to say what Cheryl is posting is wrong. Just that, if your a webmaster, I'd read the fine print and understand completely what your doing before you start applying this concept in some of the ways that have been suggested.

I've read serveral posts on here and other boards about this concept. Considering the various ways that this concept can be applied, I think a trip to a copyright lawyer would be money well spent.


On another note,

In a perfect world, there are a couple of kinks in the scenario where the surfer pays to see links. If, and this is a big if, the link list or tgp requires payment from the webmaster to get listed AND the link list or tgp requires payment from the surfer, then I want to get paid also.

Imagine this, I pay for my hosting, I paid for the content, I spent my time developing/creating the listing and I get nothing? I think this is a wrinkle that woud need to be worked out.

Even if I didnt have to pay the listing, if someone is making money off my work, I want a piece of the action.

Getting free porn off the net is a very very good idea. Getting the surfer to pay, even for the right to see the links is a good idea. I think this should be the topic on every board for next two or three weeks so smarter people than me can come up with ways that everybody can make money off the idea of charging the surfer to see links.

(sending cc holding surfers might make a difference.) .... Cheryl

I like that phrase "might make", I think this reasoning was tried with AVS sites. Not as many people made money as was expected. Caveat: I know I know, lots of people made, and are making, really good money.

P.S. Cheryl, if you ever need a job, look me up, your really good


-

***blush***

Thanks very much!

However, I do believe in the system as I am a PayAsYouClick webmaster. I am very cautious in the way I promote any sponsor and I feel that should be every webmaster's concern. After all, we are responsible for what we do. I believe in the PayAsYouClick system because it makes sense - and I have made money. Gee, don't you wish you could send your traffic to a billing source and get credit for ANY sales that surfer makes?

I don't want anyone to think I am talking on sea shells when I post... I am very new as an employee to the program and do not know all of the ins and outs. From what I can see, and how it has worked for me... I am 100% happy with it. Don't take my word for it, do it for yourself!

- cheryl

[CD Smith]

Originally Posted by bret

the same could be argued for paid submissions.. the submitters would go where it is free.

No, not really. In some cases, yes, but where the site is really huge and it's traffic valuable (Like Shemp's, Doc Bizarro, Elephant list, and dozens of others) submitters are motivated to pay, at least the serious ones are. It also cuts down on cheaters because as we all know cheaters aren't usually into paying money for anything.

With smaller less busy TGP's, yes... having paid submissions probably isn't the way to go, thus some submitters would stick with submitting to them.

Originally Posted by bret

the trust factor is huge with all the scammers out there, and they scams just keep increasing. if the surfer develops a relationship with your site, you earn their trust, and eventually maybe even their dollars.

I don't really see the parallell between submitting webmasters paying a fee and charging the surfer a user fee though, other than the fact that both are fees. Other than that, I wouldn't be surprised if your traffic took a significant drop once the fee was put in place. It's no secret that MOST surfers simply do not want to pay for anything, much less porn. A common signup ratio in this biz is 1 signup in every 500 uniques. Some see 1:200, 1:300, some see as bad as 1:5000 or worse..... I doubt that would magically change just because it is a favorite TGP now charging.

Hey, I could be wrong, but at this point in the discussion I don't think I am.

[PayAsYouClick]

Originally Posted by CD Smith

I don't really see the parallell between submitting webmasters paying a fee and charging the surfer a user fee though, other than the fact that both are fees. Other than that, I wouldn't be surprised if your traffic took a significant drop once the fee was put in place. It's no secret that MOST surfers simply do not want to pay for anything, much less porn. A common signup ratio in this biz is 1 signup in every 500 uniques. Some see 1:200, 1:300, some see as bad as 1:5000 or worse..... I doubt that would magically change just because it is a favorite TGP now charging.

Hey, I could be wrong, but at this point in the discussion I don't think I am.

The PayAsYouClick solution is NOT the same as a pay to get submitted solution though, I suppose the could exist in the same world. Since I had not thought of it I suppose webmasters could use the Payasyouclick model to offer linking opportunities to other webmasters. PayAsYouClick is a service to collect payments. I am sure, as the needs and desires arise from the community those needs and services will change at PayAsYouClick.

For now, there is no parallell and it is only a suggestion as to how to make money with the PayAsYouClick system. We are not promoting blind links, or any underhanded promises. They get what they click.... plain and simple. You get paid if they do. How simple can it get?

- cheryl

[HappySmut]

tommy your idea can defiantly work if you want to get around possible legal problems then have your paid submitters check a option to allow there galleries to also be listed at x tgp site for surfers to pay to get access to this way it covers you legally and will give that submitter the option to receive more traffic they will go for this anyway to be listed at another site to get even more traffic.

has for the actual site to do this on "I would do this" make a text listing of galleries with a traffic trade script to circle jerk the surfer but lets say 1 out of every 5 clicks the surfer is sent to a page explaining the option to pay x monthly fee so they dont get circle jerked and the paid version of the listing should have text and thumbnail version to keep your surfers paying that monthly fee. keep a extensive organized archive of multiple niches in text and thumbnail version of your "clean" listing and put in extra things to your site maybe giving away free dildos or free car oil whatever keeps them paying

surfers dont have to pay to see the latest galleries but they will have to pay if they dont want to be circle jerked and to be able to see the extensive archive and thumbnail version.

you might even just build your own galleries out of perchased content just for your 2$ surfers

and when it comes down legally "i dont think" there would be a problem since your are providing a service of organization to the surfer and traffic to the submitter and his sponsor.

if you told me your going to list my galleries behind a paid memberbased site id be very happy conversion ratio would be alot better cuase those surfers got credit cards.

[Tommy]

Remember this is just a theory
I started this thread just to say what if......
its a good thread and has a few good and bad points which make it a good discussion

I dont think it would be smart to take submits

If I were gonna do this I would build my own gallerys
maybe gallerys with 50 to 60 pics with very little advertising
I would also use some hosted galleries

[Kinky]

Originally Posted by Tommy

Remember this is just a theory
I started this thread just to say what if......
its a good thread and has a few good and bad points which make it a good discussion

I dont think it would be smart to take submits

If I were gonna do this I would build my own gallerys
maybe gallerys with 50 to 60 pics with very little advertising
I would also use some hosted galleries

wouldn't that just make it a cheap pay site with upsells then?

[Lenny]

Originally Posted by Tommy

Remember this is just a theory
I started this thread just to say what if......
its a good thread and has a few good and bad points which make it a good discussion

I dont think it would be smart to take submits

If I were gonna do this I would build my own gallerys
maybe gallerys with 50 to 60 pics with very little advertising
I would also use some hosted galleries

Hi Tommy how are you?

I think it would have to be all your own galleries. Remember you need to pay $750 and have Visa approve your urls in order to accept Visa as payment.

The problem that AVS had was that they were basically "reselling" other people's content and sites, which is why the few that remain had to make so many changes to stay Visa compliant.

Just my 2 cents.

[HappySmut]

Originally Posted by Tommy

Remember this is just a theory
I started this thread just to say what if......
its a good thread and has a few good and bad points which make it a good discussion

I dont think it would be smart to take submits

If I were gonna do this I would build my own gallerys
maybe gallerys with 50 to 60 pics with very little advertising
I would also use some hosted galleries

well if you start to do this drop me a email if ya need more galleries id be happy to build galleries with specifications just for your site

[Stever]

A large site like the Hun and others would be foolish to go to a pay model. Their high traffic IS their money flow. PERIOD.
Sure they throw sponsor stuff up to collect their 50% here and there but their real money is the banner ad spots. Some are affiliates for a % of sale, but many others are a flat monthly fee for the priveledge of being there, seen by 3.5 million per day.

In my nievity I inquired about banner spots on the Hun. I forget what the prices were, over $1000/month for good spots.?. They rotate dozens of adds and they were fully booked for the next 4 months. That's money!

And there are the sites that charge big $$ to be able to post your galleries to the top 10 spots. Essentialy the same as paying for advertising spots. That's what we are all doing here is advertising to the masses. We are not realy in the porn business. We are in the advertising business.

Free porn is a great business model for the high traffic tgp sites. Traffic comes to see it cause we all want to see sex. They need new stuff every day to maintain a reason for traffic to come, but can't possibly supply that much themselves. So us little guys keep submitting galleries to feed the demand and pray we entice a few of the masses to whip out a Credit Card cause they like our free stuff enough to see what it is like to get the full monty instead of single photos and short vid clips. For a site like the Hun to switch to a pay model, no matter how cheap, would be suicide.

Its all about the traffic!!!

Sure a small TGP with a decent amount of SE traffic could do O.K. (like cover hosting) with a pay model of some sort. Yes some people will buy anything. But that TGP would stay small and never realize the potential of a free TGP.

And the sponsors have to love the free porn model too. Those that complain about it don't have a clue how their biz even works. They end up with the best marketing team anyone could ever ask for. Hundreds, even thousands of us gallery builders are promoting for them to every corner of the traffic stream. Some of us suck at it and others are great at it. And the sponsor only has to pay for performance. Not to mention the large leak in this system where surfers who see the adds over and over finaly go to the site by typing in the main URL cause they cant remeber where to find the gallery they saw it on last night. Or those that purposely avoid affiliate links cause they don't like the thought of someone else making money off them. Or the faulty tracking systems that dont report every sale...........

Free=Money

[EDIT] I did not read all (or even most) the posts in this thread. So I am not sure how much of what I said has already been said in one way or the other. Just some of my thoughts. [EDIT/]

[SomeCreep]

Originally Posted by Tommy

This morning when I woke up I had a sort of idea

(not that I am seriously considering it)

what if ALL the tgps and linklists charged the surfers a small price for access

like 5.00 a month

people like pk worldsex and the hun could be multi millionares overnight

Turns out your vision of the future was semi-accurate. Except, that instead of TGPs charging surfers, they are charging webmasters to submit galleries.