Do you think our adult sites have any political infulance

[MadMax]

Originally Posted by Mr. Blue

This thread seems to be losing its focus and it's unfortunate that it is because something positive can come out of it. What we want is a professional statement written about the facts of what's going on, devoid of rabble rousing, devoid of personal attacks on any political entity or institution, and creating that "positive" message. If we agree that this is our goal / objective, what's the next step?

That's the page I'm on. Let's put together an outline and get it written.

[Bill]

It would actually be a pretty challenging writing job.

You would want your message to be boiled down to about 3 statements, short and emotionally vivid. Easy to remember and repeat ideas, simple and direct, that could be passed around to counter the sound bytes that big media has perfected.

So, the core should be short, one fairly short page, that you could surround with supporting pages of explanation. The core should be as self explanatory as possible, tho, and make perfect sense without any of the additional writing.

Ideally, it should be newsworthy, good enough to stand being shown on CBS, CNN, and FOX.

[guestcam]

Originally Posted by Halfdeck

Hey hey, stay on topic...

Our goal isn't to whine about Christians and the government. If all you want to do is build a blog to whine to surfers about how much Christians and Republicans suck, count me out.

You don't win a boxing match by whining about how hard the other guy is pounding you in the face. You win by pounding the other guy to the ground.

no, you're right. I dont advocate condeming christians and the gop. Thats just me venting here on the gg forums.

[Mattinblack]

I would say the next step is to start a new thread where people can post statements they have written, close it after 4-5 days and then vote for which one we feel is best to represent what we are trying to say via a poll.

[walrus]

Originally Posted by MadMax

That's the page I'm on. Let's put together an outline and get it written.

Yep, I think one of the first points we need to address is that fact that the term "child pornography" has come to be an acceptable term for describing either children being taken advantage of and children viewing porn. By lumping them together it gives the public a warped view of what's going on.

[Mattinblack]

Ok since nobody is sticking their heads above the battlements here is my draft:

Coalition of Adult Web Content Publishers

We would like to make the following statements to those who would seek to outlaw all pornography on the world wide web.

1. Without exception every responsible Adult Webmaster despises Ch1ld P0rn0r4phy and will report such activities to the authorities whenever found. It must be realised that some models who are in fact in their 20's may appear far younger.

2. It is human nature to want to engage in sexual activity. For some individuals solo sexual activity is the only sexual release they have, for varying reasons not limited to but including disability, religious convictions (prohibiting extra marital sex), and appearance.

3. There are a small number of (mostly Eastern Bloc) webmasters who are tarnishing the image of the industry as a whole by exploiting children. Do we see a call for Banks to be abolished because they hold funds for Terrorists? Some of the proposed actions are on this scale.

4. The industry employs many thousands of people in the USA alone and many tens of thousands worldwide. Shutting this industry down would have an economic impact similar to closing all the car plants in the US and relocating them in Russia.

5. It is every human beings right to make their own mind up about what they will and will not do in life. For some people pornography is abhorrant and for some people pornography is a necessity. It is pointless for the state to 'nanny' the adults within its borders. Any ban simply forces the activity to go underground and keeps the profits in the hands of those unscrupulous people who caused the problem in the first place. Did we learn nothing from the Prohibition of Alchohol?

[guestcam]

Originally Posted by walrus

Yep, I think one of the first points we need to address is that fact that the term "child pornography" has come to be an acceptable term for describing either children being taken advantage of and children viewing porn. By lumping them together it gives the public a warped view of what's going on.

actually we do not want to cloud the main issue with that topic.

we as an industry want NO PART of trying to split hairs on what CP term means what. it looks WAY too much like some sort of justication.

the only position we should take on CP is 'we will do all we can to assist any government agency in the pursuit of those criminals engaging in the production and distribution of CP'

Yeah CP is its whole own top level domain of debate. You make that a main point of our statement and it will just grab all the mass media's attention.

[guestcam]

oh and I have my statement in the making..........it was getting to 3am last night and I didnt want to START the writing then..........stay tuned.

[DJilla]

I wanted to respond to this post a few days ago when I first read it but I was on the run and had to go. If I may, I’d like to interject a whole new line of attack here for everyone to consider. This is actually a subset of thinking that I was going to approach FSC with in an offer to create/maintain a page of a similar purpose as is being talked about here.

IMHO (with some experience from the PR field) though the goals stated are lofty, the approach is all wrong! We must step outside of ourselves as adult WM’s and the concerns we have and think about the goals AND audience you are trying to reach.

The goals: reduce threat from government and private censorship, mainstream hostility to perceived attacks of CP upon the unwary, religious fanatics, improve image as hardworking, productive members of society, reduce hostility from financial organizations, increase confidence that we as an industry are responsible and are capable/willing of self policing or regulation.

Audience: mainstream citizenry and politicians over disparate time zones and cultures.

OK! Unfortunately, to be successful you have to adopt the same tried and true methods that the pros do (see decades old classic and first year student required reading: “The Hidden Persuaders” Vance Packard) which may at first glance seem shady or duplicitous.

What I mean is that a certain amount of “spin” and disinformation techniques have to be mixed with the message you are trying to deliver. In other words you can’t just preach to the choir and achieve any meaningful effect. This is because the choir already agrees with you and many avid porn surfers will never admit to it, and never admit to supporting it under any circumstances for fear (which propels a great deal of humanity towards one action or another) of rejection from their peers. Therefore they will never engage in activity that will assist in achieving the desired outcome stated in goals. Then you have the people who don’t like porn period and will never accept any message at the outset discounting it immediately because of its source.

What one must do is to attach the desired goals to a message that is acceptable to a widespread audience to consider both in content and from source. So, getting to the bottom line, that would mean wrapping the porn message within a tasty cover. I would suggest that this cover should be couched in two ways.

First: Censorship as a topic in and of itself. Political, literature, especially the arts, etc. Any improvement in atmosphere surrounding these topics will ipso facto improve the porn picture. Porn is easily characterized as the low hanging fruit which needs the greatest protection. Showing how porn is the place of choice for knee jerk reactions to an inevitable slippery slope that leads to onerous government efforts to controlling individual choices in ones general life is a message that “average people” can grasp without wrestling with moral choice. I would be focusing on all types of historical censorship and the fiascos they have lead to (the earth is flat, scientific knowledge, communism, etc., etc.)

Second: Fear of government. It’s a relatively easy target to pick on people’s natural fear of encroaching government control.

Third: Have to have the ever present “Code Of Ethics”

Fourth: Have to endorse strict adherence to every technical ability (rating systems, IE blocking, whatever) available to restrict porn from minors with in-depth explanations and links to plenty of tools available as a parental resource.

Fifth: Constantly reference that greater technical solutions are just around the corner and the matter will solve itself.

Sixth: Create an image of the perfect technical solution (which does not now exist) and endorse that this solution be adopted as quickly as possible.

Seventh: As Mattinblack referenced, a focus on the economic numbers and just how large they are. Billions are brought in by mainstream hotel chains and cable operators. Fortune five hundred companies are heavily profiting from porn. Put the heat on them by showing how widespread and how much money is involved. Take the focus off of the internet and put it on cable and publicly traded companies. Lessen the impact of internet porn by comparing it to the same concerns that existed 10, 20, 30 years ago. The world didn’t end then and won’t end now.

IMHO

[walrus]

Originally Posted by guestcam

actually we do not want to cloud the main issue with that topic.

we as an industry want NO PART of trying to split hairs on what CP term means what. it looks WAY too much like some sort of justication.

the only position we should take on CP is 'we will do all we can to assist any government agency in the pursuit of those criminals engaging in the production and distribution of CP'

Yeah CP is its whole own top level domain of debate. You make that a main point of our statement and it will just grab all the mass media's attention.

I dont think it is splitting hairs at all and is central to the debate. A gentleman I know and have a lot of respect for was not opposed to the google thing because he thought they were talking about cp. When explained the other way around...it changed his mind completely.

IMHO, it is central to everything. because as long as the opposition can tie our legitamte business to an illegal one, in the mind of the masses, they will always find support by simply wrapping in the cloak of the illegal one. To ignore and not address it gains very little because while you may sway people to our side, they wont know which side that is.

The GOP is very good at doing this and look for irregularities all you want in the last election but again IMHO their abilty to wrap Kerry into something he wasn't is largely what got "W" re-elected.

Basic NLP stuff, first start with something everyone can agree on and then lead them into morphing it into what you want them to believe.

[furrygirl]

There was a good little site run by Chi Chi LaRue before the 2004 election at ProtectOurPorn.com, but it's no longer online. It was a simple page about how if you wanted to keep your porn, you should vote for anybody but Bush, and linked to a few articles about the government's declared war on pornography.

I added it as a pop-up to my sites for a few days back then.

If someone is gong to re-do such a site, I'd recommend keeping it short and simple, just a non-pornograpic single index page with facts about the war on porn and some links to articles. I'd keep it credible, concise, clear, and free from long rants and spelling errors.

[furrygirl]

I've been repeatedly accused of being a wide-eyed feminazi nutcase, so hopefully this post isn't seen as more anti-man butch dykery from Furry Girl...

But, I can't help but notice that almost everyone who wants to be a part of this project is male.

Porn is generally attacked on two grounds:
- It's all CP, and makes people to r*pe kids
- It's all violent and degrading to women, and makes men r*pe women and beat their wives

If you're going to counter that, I suggest having some female voices as a part of any project. A random unsigned "in defense of porn" statement would most likely be read as the product of men trying to justify themselves. A well-written piece that includes sex-positive feminist perspectives, including headshots of the authors, would be better received by anyone, right or left. (Because, don't forget, the left probably hates porn more than the right, they just don't have the power to do anything about it. While the right focuses on children and decency, the left focuses on "women's rights".)

[DJilla]

Originally Posted by Halfdeck

How about this?

http://www.googlefight.com/index.php...dren+from+porn

Cute link... that's a keeper!

[Toby]

Hmmmm, I find myself in complete agreement with all three posts made last night by furrygirl. It would seem that one or both of us are mellowing with age.

[furrygirl]

Originally Posted by Toby

Hmmmm, I find myself in complete agreement with all three posts made last night by furrygirl. It would seem that one or both of us are mellowing with age.

I assume you mean my other one about "teen" sites? Well, then, thank you, kindly.

And hopefully this thread won't get forgotten. It's a great project, and I'm happy to help and offer some pointers on a manifesto from a chick who's heavily into sex/porn-positive feminism.