doorway pages

horndog · 2008-02-05, 02:32 PM

I was wondering if anybody uses doorway pages much. I noticed that quite a few of the link list won't take them because they like you to submit the index page. I've just been building a free site,putting my reciprocals on it, submitting ,and then moving on to building the next site. Is their a better way. Any info would help.
Thanks

LD · 2008-02-05, 05:17 PM

Horndog, you might do a search on mirrors.

horney · 2008-02-05, 06:42 PM

Is that what was meant? I thought it was about having a place to put all the recip tables and having each of the free sites branching off from there - and I can see the logic. As well as where the logic breaks down.

Either way, horndog has a valid point. Doing it the current way is tedious. I can understand why people want to use templates, autosubmission and the rest. The time consumed in generating and testing a single free site which looks fresh, to me at least, justifies a reasonable return before the additional time spent in putting recip tables with cats together and submitting them through the self-protection barriers imposed by the list owners, however well justified.

I don't have templates. I designed a stylesheet when I started and keep kicking it about and altering the content to make each site look different whatever the photographic materials and sponsor banners I have at my disposal.

It doesn't look too much now like it did when I started, just a dozen or so sites ago, but I can always return to earlier instances and tweak them differently. Only the list owners/approvers can say whether the effort is likely to prove worthwhile in the longer run (all feedback appreciated).

There is, in my humble opinion, an awful lot of effort already invested in that.

So is there an easier way, or have the scam/spam merchants beaten us into submission?

Sounds a bit like the freedom versus islamo-fascism argument in the UK, as it happens. All we needed was a Stalinist Prime Minister to get into office during a security alert. The answer's obvious. Fuck freedom.

horndog · 2008-02-05, 07:13 PM

Thanks for the input Luscious and Horney,
I guess what I should of asked is it even a good idea to use doorway pages or mirror your index page. Of course with each doorway page you could put 15 to 20 more reciprocals and submit to more link list. But I've read that the search engines don't like doorway pages because they see it as spamming.

horney · 2008-02-05, 07:59 PM

That's what mirror pages are designed to sidestep. You make a site in a folder, make 1, 2, however many you like, copies. Each is a sub-folder of your main site. Each copy, including the original, has a separate recips table on index.html with different lists' recips on it. ALL of the rest of each site is straight copies of the one you designed to start with.

You name the 2, 3, 4 or more sites so they are not an obvious numerical sequence (a mistake I made with my first half a dozen or so sites) so nobody can even guess which is the "original" site and which are the mirrors. Those list owners who get upset if they think they are down your rankings can't tell where they are in your rankings.

Now, if you have control of your server, and if you don't mind that it takes more time than to ftp to each mirror anyway, and you don't mind the fact that you have to physically make each simlink - you can script it but for these purposes that may be even more time consuming - you can simlink each page so you just have one copy of each page, plus a separate index.html, for each mirror.

Then, if you want to make changes or make an update, you can do it in one place and it happens on all mirrors simultaneously. Unlike using a script with, say, .php extensions, you can call each page what you wish, so for instance it could be gallery1.html in one instance, show1.html in another, parade1.html in another. SEs treat each simlink as though it were a separate page and the list owners' scripts can't tell either.

It is the technique by which your web host give you "your own" instance of phpMyAdmin and webmail, to name but two - it has to be on the same server or have a very experienced and competent developer.

So, back to the question. No to doorways. yes to mirrors. There is more than one way to create a mirror so it's up to you how you do it, but copying your original site folder, renaming each copy, then changing the index.html page in each copy is very easy.

I came across a list where the conditions stated the owner hates mirrors. Rather than asking how he knew which was the mirror and which was the site, because unless you really make it obvious as I did to start with, and having had a bottle of wine or so at the time, I thought "What a pillock!" and didn't bother submitting.

horndog · 2008-02-05, 08:25 PM

AHH! Thats what I was looking for. So I should just mirror my site and stick a different set of reciprocals on the index.html page of the mirror site instead of fooling with doorway pages.

Thanks Horney

LD · 2008-02-07, 09:36 AM

Good info Honey, I've only recently started doing mirrors, and my traffic has doubled. There are some excellent threads here if you do a search. I get the impression most people are doing mirrors. I have been using the 1,2,3 etc naming thing...whoops, I probably need to change that.

When I first started submitting, many of the list had rules against using mirrors, but that rule seems to be fading away.

horndog · 2008-02-07, 12:53 PM

Alright, I'll search through the threads and see what I can dig up.

horney · 2008-02-07, 02:53 PM

I understand the list owners have to protect themselves and that there is a lot of crap out there trying to get in if you let it.

But some of the methods are downright impractical. There are so many ways to hide mirrors, making each site seem like the only, the original, and there are so many lists vying for submissions and with genuine traffic to offer, it is a frustrating waste of time for all concerned to try and deny them.

May as well admit and accept it, so long as there are enough good sites and enough good lists, mirrors have a real place in free site marketing with a real job to do.

horndog · 2008-02-08, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by horney

But some of the methods are downright impractical. There are so many ways to hide mirrors, making each site seem like the only, the original, and there are so many lists vying for submissions and with genuine traffic to offer, it is a frustrating waste of time for all concerned to try and deny them.

I was looking into mirroring as a way to try and milk more out of each site and make it more productive. After searching through some of the threads though it seemed that most people said it didn't pay off to try and submit to more and more linklist. I have personally only been submitting to about twenty. But I may give mirroring a try though and see how it works. It's just something I was checking into.

horney · 2008-02-08, 08:11 PM

Few people are saying anything about which lists genuinely produce traffic for submitters, other than for the small handful at the very top.

So without linking to a lot of different lists for at least a few sites each, how are you going to find out which ones will work for you?

Without a bigger recip table than the lists would accept, how are you going to give enough of them space whilst doing so? Very few will accept gateway pages, and they in turn all want to be on the first page of a not overcrowded first page.

Mirror sites. Unless someone has found a holy grail which is remaining stubbornly invisible to me.

ponygirl · 2008-02-08, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by horney

Few people are saying anything about which lists genuinely produce traffic for submitters, other than for the small handful at the very top.

So without linking to a lot of different lists for at least a few sites each, how are you going to find out which ones will work for you?

Without a bigger recip table than the lists would accept, how are you going to give enough of them space whilst doing so? Very few will accept gateway pages, and they in turn all want to be on the first page of a not overcrowded first page.

Mirror sites. Unless someone has found a holy grail which is remaining stubbornly invisible to me.

Lots of 'smaller' link lists don't mind mirrors if they're done correctly. Most that I know, in fact. They may not send lots of traffic, but they might also be steady and/or growing. They probably don't mind too much if they're not on THE index page, or in the 'big guys' recip tables.

I find it doesn't take me that much longer to do a couple more recip tables so I can submit to all the sites I want to.

Some will send more traffic for certain cateories, so really the only way to know is to experiment. Submit a couple of mirrors for the next few sites and see what happens. Take a look in the 'Link Lists & Getting Listed' threads and see who's taking submits, or just look through threads at people's sigs. There's lots of good LL owners in here

what I meant to say, is that horney's right

horney · 2008-02-08, 08:41 PM

I think the big guys acknowledge them too. Some still insist on being on the same recip table as other big guys, but not necessarily with all of the other big guys. So it's possible to spread them around within reason.

horndog · 2008-02-09, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ponygirl

Take a look in the 'Link Lists & Getting Listed' threads and see who's taking submits, or just look through threads at people's sigs. There's lots of good LL owners in here

what I meant to say, is that horney's right

Ponygirl,
If your taking submits I'll send you my next free site.

2008-02-05, 02:32 PM	#1
horndog Well you know boys, a nuclear reactor is a lot like women. You just have to read the manual and press the right button Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 154	doorway pages I was wondering if anybody uses doorway pages much. I noticed that quite a few of the link list won't take them because they like you to submit the index page. I've just been building a free site,putting my reciprocals on it, submitting ,and then moving on to building the next site. Is their a better way. Any info would help. Thanks

2008-02-05, 05:17 PM	#2
LD wtfwjd? Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 2,103	Horndog, you might do a search on mirrors. __________________ Artisteer Wordpress Theme Generator Create Custom Themes! My Little Network

2008-02-05, 06:42 PM	#3
horney Shut up brain, or I'll stab you with a Q-tip! Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 111	Is that what was meant? I thought it was about having a place to put all the recip tables and having each of the free sites branching off from there - and I can see the logic. As well as where the logic breaks down. Either way, horndog has a valid point. Doing it the current way is tedious. I can understand why people want to use templates, autosubmission and the rest. The time consumed in generating and testing a single free site which looks fresh, to me at least, justifies a reasonable return before the additional time spent in putting recip tables with cats together and submitting them through the self-protection barriers imposed by the list owners, however well justified. I don't have templates. I designed a stylesheet when I started and keep kicking it about and altering the content to make each site look different whatever the photographic materials and sponsor banners I have at my disposal. It doesn't look too much now like it did when I started, just a dozen or so sites ago, but I can always return to earlier instances and tweak them differently. Only the list owners/approvers can say whether the effort is likely to prove worthwhile in the longer run (all feedback appreciated). There is, in my humble opinion, an awful lot of effort already invested in that. So is there an easier way, or have the scam/spam merchants beaten us into submission? Sounds a bit like the freedom versus islamo-fascism argument in the UK, as it happens. All we needed was a Stalinist Prime Minister to get into office during a security alert. The answer's obvious. Fuck freedom. Last edited by horney; 2008-02-05 at 06:49 PM..

2008-02-07, 09:36 AM	#7
LD wtfwjd? Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 2,103	Good info Honey, I've only recently started doing mirrors, and my traffic has doubled. There are some excellent threads here if you do a search. I get the impression most people are doing mirrors. I have been using the 1,2,3 etc naming thing...whoops, I probably need to change that. When I first started submitting, many of the list had rules against using mirrors, but that rule seems to be fading away. __________________ Artisteer Wordpress Theme Generator Create Custom Themes! My Little Network

2008-02-05, 07:13 PM	#4
horndog Well you know boys, a nuclear reactor is a lot like women. You just have to read the manual and press the right button Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 154	Thanks for the input Luscious and Horney, I guess what I should of asked is it even a good idea to use doorway pages or mirror your index page. Of course with each doorway page you could put 15 to 20 more reciprocals and submit to more link list. But I've read that the search engines don't like doorway pages because they see it as spamming.

2008-02-05, 07:59 PM	#5
horney Shut up brain, or I'll stab you with a Q-tip! Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 111	That's what mirror pages are designed to sidestep. You make a site in a folder, make 1, 2, however many you like, copies. Each is a sub-folder of your main site. Each copy, including the original, has a separate recips table on index.html with different lists' recips on it. ALL of the rest of each site is straight copies of the one you designed to start with. You name the 2, 3, 4 or more sites so they are not an obvious numerical sequence (a mistake I made with my first half a dozen or so sites) so nobody can even guess which is the "original" site and which are the mirrors. Those list owners who get upset if they think they are down your rankings can't tell where they are in your rankings. Now, if you have control of your server, and if you don't mind that it takes more time than to ftp to each mirror anyway, and you don't mind the fact that you have to physically make each simlink - you can script it but for these purposes that may be even more time consuming - you can simlink each page so you just have one copy of each page, plus a separate index.html, for each mirror. Then, if you want to make changes or make an update, you can do it in one place and it happens on all mirrors simultaneously. Unlike using a script with, say, .php extensions, you can call each page what you wish, so for instance it could be gallery1.html in one instance, show1.html in another, parade1.html in another. SEs treat each simlink as though it were a separate page and the list owners' scripts can't tell either. It is the technique by which your web host give you "your own" instance of phpMyAdmin and webmail, to name but two - it has to be on the same server or have a very experienced and competent developer. So, back to the question. No to doorways. yes to mirrors. There is more than one way to create a mirror so it's up to you how you do it, but copying your original site folder, renaming each copy, then changing the index.html page in each copy is very easy. I came across a list where the conditions stated the owner hates mirrors. Rather than asking how he knew which was the mirror and which was the site, because unless you really make it obvious as I did to start with, and having had a bottle of wine or so at the time, I thought "What a pillock!" and didn't bother submitting.

2008-02-05, 08:25 PM	#6
horndog Well you know boys, a nuclear reactor is a lot like women. You just have to read the manual and press the right button Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 154	AHH! Thats what I was looking for. So I should just mirror my site and stick a different set of reciprocals on the index.html page of the mirror site instead of fooling with doorway pages. Thanks Horney

2008-02-07, 12:53 PM	#8
horndog Well you know boys, a nuclear reactor is a lot like women. You just have to read the manual and press the right button Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 154	Alright, I'll search through the threads and see what I can dig up.

2008-02-07, 02:53 PM	#9
horney Shut up brain, or I'll stab you with a Q-tip! Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 111	I understand the list owners have to protect themselves and that there is a lot of crap out there trying to get in if you let it. But some of the methods are downright impractical. There are so many ways to hide mirrors, making each site seem like the only, the original, and there are so many lists vying for submissions and with genuine traffic to offer, it is a frustrating waste of time for all concerned to try and deny them. May as well admit and accept it, so long as there are enough good sites and enough good lists, mirrors have a real place in free site marketing with a real job to do.

2008-02-08, 08:11 PM	#11
horney Shut up brain, or I'll stab you with a Q-tip! Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 111	Few people are saying anything about which lists genuinely produce traffic for submitters, other than for the small handful at the very top. So without linking to a lot of different lists for at least a few sites each, how are you going to find out which ones will work for you? Without a bigger recip table than the lists would accept, how are you going to give enough of them space whilst doing so? Very few will accept gateway pages, and they in turn all want to be on the first page of a not overcrowded first page. Mirror sites. Unless someone has found a holy grail which is remaining stubbornly invisible to me.

2008-02-08, 08:41 PM	#13
horney Shut up brain, or I'll stab you with a Q-tip! Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 111	I think the big guys acknowledge them too. Some still insist on being on the same recip table as other big guys, but not necessarily with all of the other big guys. So it's possible to spread them around within reason.