What's the point of opening your own pay site?

[Star Man]

I mean with many sponsors paying out $25.00-$35.00 bucks a sign up,hosting the members section,and probably better marketing skills then most can complete with,I just don't see the benefit of attempting to do it all on your own. I mean if your banging these hoe's or producing your own content,I can see why it could work but other then that I don't see the point.What am I missing here?

[Toby]

When you do the math don't forget the rebills. $25- $35 per initial signup is chump change. Non-exclusive content is relatively cheap. If you have an existing network of traffic to drive to it, a well designed and maintained pay site can do very well.

[Licker4U]

After surfing for porn back in '97 I decided I wanted to shoot my own content and have my own pay site. I found a model release form on line and copied it. I found a rate sheet for different kinds of shoots and copied that. Then I found a newbie webmaster board and thank God I did. I would have sunk a LOT of money into a losing venture. They told me I should build free sites for a while and learn how to get and manipulate traffic and learn about porn before I jump into a full blown pay site. I'm still making free sites but my dream is still there. If Papa can do it, I can too :D I think a lot of models for porn come from exotic dancing (titty bars). Many of them are exhibitionists anyway and they're already used to people seeing their bodies so it's a logical step. My 26 yr. old son knows a lot of girls that dance locally so that's my connection with some of the girls. I just need to get a little money to invest and start shooting |bananna|

[LD]

I've thought about it too...there's no way I could do the content (well maybe with a shit load of Viagra...), but it would be cool to partner with a studio or something, maybe be involved a little in the actual production side.

It seems like there's an awful lot of paysites out there, though. I'm still learning doing my little freesites, linklist blogs...but it sure sounds interesting.

[cd34]

Here's what I've observed over time.

There are webmasters that understand traffic generation, and can cultivate surfers that are willing to purchase and send them to a content site.

There are webmasters that know how to run a paysite, manage models, photoshoots, content generation, etc.

There are very few that can do both well.

If you were in a particular niche, had your own segment of traffic that you knew converted pretty well, had access to unique or exclusive content that fit that niche, you could make a single paysite and probably make it work. But, you're going to be splitting your efforts somewhat -- perhaps you spend too much time working the content/paysite side and neglect your traffic generation, or vice versa. Its a rather delicate balance, one that I've seen very few people manage to do well.

If you were going to do a paysite, you would want something that was unique enough that you could open a site with 12k pictures and 50 videos and work on retention while maintaining your other income stream. The other thing you probably don't want to get trapped in is a solo model site initially. You get x sets done, money doesn't come in quick enough, model decides to shop around or worse, is hard to get to show up to additional shoots. Stick with a niche so you're not tied to a particular model.

Its not impossible to make money with it, the barrier to entry is somewhat low if you pay the $750 visa/mc fee and use ccbill and it wouldn't take too many signups to cover that and generate some income. Your problems start with understanding how to convert more clickers into sales, what makes a member recur from the inside, etc.

Its tough, but, with the right niche, I think it is doable.

[HowlingWulf]

I used to think about opening my own paysites, and I came to this conclusion:

It's a lot of work.

Buying/producing content, managing affiliates/traffic, conversions, rebills, networking etc.... that's just not what I want.

I like working my own hours, taking off whenever I want (and I vacation/goof off a lot), and I make a good income as an affiliate with little overhead/responsibilities. That's what I like. I sometimes put in a full day but usually a few hours is enough for me.

Granted some people make lots of money starting their own sites/programs but I'm guessing most of them don't do so well and we never hear about most of them.

[JustRobert]

Very nice post cd34.
You answered questions that have been running thru my mind recently.

[Star Man]

When you do the math don't forget the rebills. $25- $35 per initial signup is chump change. Non-exclusive content is relatively cheap. If you have an existing network of traffic to drive to it, a well designed and maintained pay site can do very well.
Yeah I bet rebills would kick ass...just gotta keep em happy.Also I hear that member section traffic is top notch.Over time,that could be a nice personal traffic source to have handy if it's really that good.The pay site thing is starting to make much more sense.

Licker4U and LusciousDelight ,you guys got me thinking with your posts.I have that porn star fantasy too (I'm sooo original:D).I always thought that the only way to do it is to just bang on anabolic's door and harass the hell out of them but with the internet,I guess anyone can reach MILF Hunter status over night if they knew how to work a PC and get adult traffic.Technically I could do it all myself but I don't know if I have the motivation.One things for sure,living out my cliche porn star fantasy would make turning 30 in a year seem like far less of a fucking death sentence!|goodnight

[Star Man]

Here's what I've observed over time.

There are webmasters that understand traffic generation, and can cultivate surfers that are willing to purchase and send them to a content site.

There are webmasters that know how to run a paysite, manage models, photoshoots, content generation, etc.

There are very few that can do both well.
Yeah,good post cd34.Even if it's possible to juggle both,it would probably take a monumental amount of energy.

[annie_cash]

I once took photos to a friend of mine who is bi-sexual and now he says he want to start his own porn site. The thing is he's ugly for the average eye; have tons of scarces around the body and a severe speaking problem, so I dont know how many people would pay to join his site (though thinking twise he can be some kind of "exotic" guy) anyways, the day I have time and some $ to invert I will make him a site and see what happens.

[webpimp]

Great post cd34, I think that captures the amount of work required to be successful with a paysite. With so many great paysites already out there, it's a smart move to worry about generating traffic before building a paysite.

[webpimp]

I once took photos to a friend of mine who is bi-sexual and now he says he want to start his own porn site. The thing is he's ugly for the average eye; have tons of scarces around the body and a severe speaking problem, so I dont know how many people would pay to join his site (though thinking twise he can be some kind of "exotic" guy) anyways, the day I have time and some $ to invert I will make him a site and see what happens.

In today's world of online porn, it often pays to have unique content. Although successful promotion might require some pretty degrading marketing tactics. But sounds like this guy has enough confidence to take it.

[Ms Naughty]

Degrading? Might be a nice way to drive away potential customers, actually. If the guy is bi he might want to do his own personality-driven site, one that respects the members and himself.

[SheepGuy]

I had 3 paysites in partnership with 2 friends back in the day when even non-exclusive content was expensive, my bills to keep them going were roughly 3K a month and I ran them for about 6 months.
Signups were plentiful back then but I got tired of the workload and I couldn't see any of them getting to the point where I'd get rich so I sold my share to my partners for 4 double Wild Turkeys at the local pub.
I haven't regretted it at all. Owning a paysite is a different kind of work than what most of us do now and once I was rid of them I started enjoying the biz again, and making more money.

[webpimp]

Degrading? Might be a nice way to drive away potential customers, actually. If the guy is bi he might want to do his own personality-driven site, one that respects the members and himself.

That's probably a better idea, I don't really know that audience. Just doing a little armchair speculation, based on some of the sites I've seen out there.

[Licker4U]

One things for sure,living out my cliche porn star fantasy would make turning 30 in a year seem like far less of a fucking death sentence!|goodnight

I never had a fantasy of actually being in the shoots, I just wanted to take my own pictures of girls solo or with other guys. You know, have control of my content. PapaGMP has the best of both worlds, he takes the photos/movies and gets laid. |bananna| i just like the idea of taking the pics....and a little on the side wouldn't hurt....:D

Now if Papa wants to schedule a shoot on the Gulf Coast of Alabama, I'm available.....|boobies|

(might be a nice tax write off for a kewl vacation for him and some of his girls)

[papagmp]

OK - I guess it my turn to chime in.

Let's lay out the last week (at least as well as I can remember it)

Friday, 1 August, 02:45am - phone ringing off the hook - one of my models in in jail and her BF is calling wanting me to bail her out. Stayed up all night - finally got her out at 11:45am. I did get a FS built and did the dishes. Spent the afternoon making a new blog, submitting the FS I built and took 30 minutes to jerk off before I went to the club to see if Serenity was going to be there for the shoot Sunday. Returned from the club at 11:45 and took a nap.

Saturday, 2 August, woke up around 2:57am because the cat wanted in. checked my emails and had a customer that couldn't log in. re-sent him his password. Called my kids in Germany - chatted with a friend in Europe on ICQ. Still sending ICQ's at 6:19am. Pretty sure I jerked off somewhere in there. Fell asleep at the keyboard but managed to wake up in time to got shopping before OTB at 1pm (local). Jack came over at 3 and I trained her on making FS's. Went to the shop and set up the studio for Sunday's shoot. Got home at 9:45pm. Met with a new model at 10:00pm - signed contracts and took her to the club to meet a few of the girls. Got home at 2:20 am on Sunday morning.

Sunday, 3 August, ICQ shows me working on a new blog with a friend from 2:56am till 6:10am. My ex-wife's sister called just after lunch time and said she had something for me - dropped by 30 minutes later to give me her 2-week notice for the tipi shop. (Good news is I no longer have to worry about her quiting if/when I post the videos of her sister on the site). Went to the shop (studio) at 3pm and waited for Serenity - she didn't show........ Tried to call her and got no answer. Called the new model and she said she could come over - started shooting her around midnight. Finished the shoot and had the lights torn down and packed up by 3am.

Monday, 4 August, Woke up at 8:30 and loaded all the computers in the car and took them to the tipi shop. Promoted Kiri to Sales Manager and started training her on the new position. Spent all day Monday at the tipi shop working on computers and training. Left the shop around 5pm - went to the bank and post office and stopped by the club to see why the fuck Serenity hadn't shown up. Stayed at the club till the night shift girls came in and then came home. Slept for a few hours.

Tuesday, 5 August, middle of the fuckin night - wake to the phone ringing - Jack's roommate is in jail and needs me to post bail. Got out of bed and worked on a new FS and a picture set. Backed up the pictures of the new model. Slept a bit then got up at 9am - worked on the sites for an hour then went back to the tipi shop to help the new girl. Got home around 6pm. Re-rendered a bunch of videos that I had screwed up so I could get the new set posted to Real Colorado Girls - finished a freesite, ftp'd a new video to Glass Mannequin and loaded it in the database. Went to bed in the early am.

Wednesday, 6 August, Serenity text;s me and says she'll do a "bring me your sister: shoot tonight. I'm not rested but we need the content. I clean the house and do laundry between reviews and submits. No jerking off today cuz I need to dump a huge load in Serenity's eye as payback for standing me up on - fuck - when was she supposed to shoot???? Went to the office and signed payroll checks - went top pick Serenity up and she wasn't home - I did get to meet her boy friend - that was nice............... Went home and jerked off..... Got to bed around - fuck - I listened to Bob and Tom so it must have been 10am before I fell asleep.

Thursday, 7 August, Fuckin phone started ringing at noon. It was the tipi shop - customers and suppliers needed calls. Farted around for a bit - then crashed for a few more hours. Got up in time to be at the club to chew Serenity's ass - she wants to shoot Sunday - not sure if i will (BS - the little cunt is HOT and I really want to fuck her). Built a FS template for an affiliate cuz I was feeling in a creative mood - it was my first FS made to fit a 1024x768 screen. Edited a bunch of vid caps for banners and made a bunch of new banners for Real Colorado Girls. FTP's another video up to Real Colorado Girls. Balanced the checkbooks and crashed ------- couldn't sleep - got up and listened to Bob and Tom - went to sleep around 8am (sometime during the day I pulled my back while pulling weeds behind the tipi in a rain storm) Submitted a FS sometime during the day???

Friiday, 8 August. Got up to the phone at 10am. Jack was here editing video - she never wakes me up if I'm sleeping. Fucking back was killing me. Finished the FS template for my affiliate and took off to Denver to pick up a load of canvas. Had to be back by 7 so Jack could go to work. Tried to take a nap but remembered I had to clean the hottub. Drained and cleaned the hottub and it's filling as I type this - off to the club for a few minutes to have a beer. Hottub is filling and I need a good hot soak ----- after I jerk off!

See you all in the morning on OTB......:D

[Star Man]

I never had a fantasy of actually being in the shoots, I just wanted to take my own pictures of girls solo or with other guys. You know, have control of my content. PapaGMP has the best of both worlds, he takes the photos/movies and gets laid. |bananna| i just like the idea of taking the pics....and a little on the side wouldn't hurt....:D
Actually,directing a shoot and getting some on the side would be ideal (better sex too I bet) but I'd jump in a shoot in a second if I had the opportunity.'Fantasy' may have been the wrong choice of words (sounds sort of cheesy) but the desire is definitely there.What can I say? My little head OWNS me.|loony|

|pimpin Thats pimp PapaGMP! Don't get me wrong,I'm sure your having fun but are there ever moments during a shoot where it's 'just another day at work' instead of getting laid? Do you ever work with a girl that your just not attracted to at all? Just curious.

[papagmp]

Actually,directing a shoot and getting some on the side would be ideal (better sex too I bet) but I'd jump in a shoot in a second if I had the opportunity.'Fantasy' may have been the wrong choice of words (sounds sort of cheesy) but the desire is definitely there.What can I say? My little head OWNS me.|loony|

|pimpin Thats pimp PapaGMP! Don't get me wrong,I'm sure your having fun but are there ever moments during a shoot where it's 'just another day at work' instead of getting laid? Do you ever work with a girl that your just not attracted to at all? Just curious.

LOL - actually - there are only a few of the girls that I would fuck off-camera. And 3 or four that are just not my type and I would never fuck on my own time. And yes - I could get it hard for a cold piece of liver if it was for the "cause'.

And there have only been three of my models that I ever fucked off camera. Most have a life of their own - and it's because I respect that, that the girls are willing to work for/with PapaGMP.

[Licker4U]

OK - I guess it my turn to chime in.

Let's lay out the last week (at least as well as I can remember it)

Friday, 1 August, 02:45am - phone ringing off the hook - one of my models in in jail and her BF is calling wanting me to bail her out. Stayed up all night - finally got her out at 11:45am. I did get a FS built and did the dishes. Spent the afternoon making a new blog, submitting the FS I built and took 30 minutes to jerk off before I went to the club to see if Serenity was going to be there for the shoot Sunday. Returned from the club at 11:45 and took a nap.

Saturday, 2 August, woke up around 2:57am because the cat wanted in. checked my emails and had a customer that couldn't log in. re-sent him his password. Called my kids in Germany - chatted with a friend in Europe on ICQ. Still sending ICQ's at 6:19am. Pretty sure I jerked off somewhere in there. Fell asleep at the keyboard but managed to wake up in time to got shopping before OTB at 1pm (local). Jack came over at 3 and I trained her on making FS's. Went to the shop and set up the studio for Sunday's shoot. Got home at 9:45pm. Met with a new model at 10:00pm - signed contracts and took her to the club to meet a few of the girls. Got home at 2:20 am on Sunday morning.

Sunday, 3 August, ICQ shows me working on a new blog with a friend from 2:56am till 6:10am. My ex-wife's sister called just after lunch time and said she had something for me - dropped by 30 minutes later to give me her 2-week notice for the tipi shop. (Good news is I no longer have to worry about her quiting if/when I post the videos of her sister on the site). Went to the shop (studio) at 3pm and waited for Serenity - she didn't show........ Tried to call her and got no answer. Called the new model and she said she could come over - started shooting her around midnight. Finished the shoot and had the lights torn down and packed up by 3am.

Monday, 4 August, Woke up at 8:30 and loaded all the computers in the car and took them to the tipi shop. Promoted Kiri to Sales Manager and started training her on the new position. Spent all day Monday at the tipi shop working on computers and training. Left the shop around 5pm - went to the bank and post office and stopped by the club to see why the fuck Serenity hadn't shown up. Stayed at the club till the night shift girls came in and then came home. Slept for a few hours.

Tuesday, 5 August, middle of the fuckin night - wake to the phone ringing - Jack's roommate is in jail and needs me to post bail. Got out of bed and worked on a new FS and a picture set. Backed up the pictures of the new model. Slept a bit then got up at 9am - worked on the sites for an hour then went back to the tipi shop to help the new girl. Got home around 6pm. Re-rendered a bunch of videos that I had screwed up so I could get the new set posted to Real Colorado Girls - finished a freesite, ftp'd a new video to Glass Mannequin and loaded it in the database. Went to bed in the early am.

Wednesday, 6 August, Serenity text;s me and says she'll do a "bring me your sister: shoot tonight. I'm not rested but we need the content. I clean the house and do laundry between reviews and submits. No jerking off today cuz I need to dump a huge load in Serenity's eye as payback for standing me up on - fuck - when was she supposed to shoot???? Went to the office and signed payroll checks - went top pick Serenity up and she wasn't home - I did get to meet her boy friend - that was nice............... Went home and jerked off..... Got to bed around - fuck - I listened to Bob and Tom so it must have been 10am before I fell asleep.

Thursday, 7 August, Fuckin phone started ringing at noon. It was the tipi shop - customers and suppliers needed calls. Farted around for a bit - then crashed for a few more hours. Got up in time to be at the club to chew Serenity's ass - she wants to shoot Sunday - not sure if i will (BS - the little cunt is HOT and I really want to fuck her). Built a FS template for an affiliate cuz I was feeling in a creative mood - it was my first FS made to fit a 1024x768 screen. Edited a bunch of vid caps for banners and made a bunch of new banners for Real Colorado Girls. FTP's another video up to Real Colorado Girls. Balanced the checkbooks and crashed ------- couldn't sleep - got up and listened to Bob and Tom - went to sleep around 8am (sometime during the day I pulled my back while pulling weeds behind the tipi in a rain storm) Submitted a FS sometime during the day???

Friiday, 8 August. Got up to the phone at 10am. Jack was here editing video - she never wakes me up if I'm sleeping. Fucking back was killing me. Finished the FS template for my affiliate and took off to Denver to pick up a load of canvas. Had to be back by 7 so Jack could go to work. Tried to take a nap but remembered I had to clean the hottub. Drained and cleaned the hottub and it's filling as I type this - off to the club for a few minutes to have a beer. Hottub is filling and I need a good hot soak ----- after I jerk off!

See you all in the morning on OTB......:D

Ahhhh, the life of a pornographer......I could say almost the same things about being an electrical contractor. Same shit, different profession. :D

[faxxaff]

When you do the math don't forget the rebills. $25- $35 per initial signup is chump change. Non-exclusive content is relatively cheap. If you have an existing network of traffic to drive to it, a well designed and maintained pay site can do very well.

Rebills from own traffic is the best income. I closed a paysite with around 300 members in February last year. After 18 months I still have around 60 members on recurring. I am thinking about reopening the site again in the near future once I install a content management script.

[Star Man]

LOL - actually - there are only a few of the girls that I would fuck off-camera. And 3 or four that are just not my type and I would never fuck on my own time. And yes - I could get it hard for a cold piece of liver if it was for the "cause'.

And there have only been three of my models that I ever fucked off camera. Most have a life of their own - and it's because I respect that, that the girls are willing to work for/with PapaGMP.
LOL ,at least your honest about it though dude.(Yes,you could have given a total mother fucker answer and would have gotten away with it :D )

[Pagan]

groan.. what a schedule! You can still perform tired??? My respect for you has deepened tremendously Papa. I promise I won't complain about my 80 weeks anymore.. ever. (40 hours a week on a day job, 10 hours commuting, 30 hours a week on my sites).

[papagmp]

Ahhhh, the life of a pornographer......I could say almost the same things about being an electrical contractor. Same shit, different profession. :D

LOL - been there - done that....

But I enjoy sticking my cock in the sockets in this industry much more than when I wired housed for my brother-in-law |shocking|

[papagmp]

groan.. what a schedule! You can still perform tired??? My respect for you has deepened tremendously Papa. I promise I won't complain about my 80 weeks anymore.. ever. (40 hours a week on a day job, 10 hours commuting, 30 hours a week on my sites).

Hey - I'm not complaining - but it's a LOT of work.

Just got back from the club - now back to building FS's |loony|

[tigermom]

There are various ways of making money from paysites. You mentioned high PPS payments to affiliates. With many of these sites, the subscription money is, or should be, only part of the site owner's income. Even with sites built to never rebill, the program makes more money from x-sales along with some shady tricks (described in a thread here not too long ago). It is not simple and it's easy to lose money if you don't know exactly what you're doing. They need to average more per sale, so they can pay X amount of money to the referring affiliate.

If you're not one of the sharks who knows how to properly manage a PPS model, you're bound to lose a lot of money.

Then there's the more traditional concept where you make a quality site, meant to rebill, and make your money from the rebills. Those programs usually operate on the revshare model, so affiliates are making money from the rebills as well. Papa here operates that kind of site, by that model. However, you most certainly don't have to produce content in order to run a paysite. You can get exclusive or non-exclusive content, or both, without ever touching a camera or seeing a model.

If you're just looking for ways to get laid, there are services for that, and they're cheaper than producing porn ;) Ask Papa here how much he paid for legal services alone, before he set up his business... and no, it's not the only thing you pay for - there are TONS of expenses, especially if you want to produce the content yourself.


I like working my own hours, taking off whenever I want (and I vacation/goof off a lot), and I make a good income as an affiliate with little overhead/responsibilities. That's what I like. I sometimes put in a full day but usually a few hours is enough for me.

Granted some people make lots of money starting their own sites/programs but I'm guessing most of them don't do so well and we never hear about most of them.

Same here. I just don't want the obligation of having to manage a paysite. And I definitely don't want to have to deal with content production. It's great for some people, but not for me.

[CaptainJSparrow]

Hey Papa, what's a tipi shop?

[Maj. Stress]

Hey Papa, what's a tipi shop?

http://www.reesetipis.com/

[papagmp]

Hey Papa, what's a tipi shop?

Tipi Shop (http://indian-tipis-tepees-teepees.com/gallery/78/around-reese-tipis-3032.jpg) - place where overworked and under paid women make Native American tipis (http://www.reesetipis.com/index.cfm) - also known as tepees or teepees.

The tipi shop also doubles as my photo studio where we get a bit crazy (http://www.outlawfreeporn.com/fun/DSCN2006-10-01_00324.jpg) at times.

You will also see a few tipis in some of my nasty work - including the one featured in my very first freesite (http://www.outlawamateurs.com/index.html) and a bunch of the Real Colorado Girls (http://realcoloradogirls.com/main.php) episodes are filmed in the tipi or greenhouse tipi in my back yard

Now that I posted this, I'll be getting folks calling and asking if they can get a tipi complete with a Real Colorado Girl.... :D

[CaptainJSparrow]

So, Papa, you own a tipi shop? Just curious, who buys tee pees, I mean, who is your target demographic? I'm not trying to be facetious, I'm just curious.

I remember reviewing your first freesite, that you mentioned above, even though it was quite a while ago. It stood out, in a good way.

[papagmp]

So, Papa, you own a tipi shop? Just curious, who buys tee pees, I mean, who is your target demographic? I'm not trying to be facetious, I'm just curious.

I remember reviewing your first freesite, that you mentioned above, even though it was quite a while ago. It stood out, in a good way.

Most of our customers put their tipis in their back yards or on their 2nd property in the mountain, on the river, lake etc...

We do have a few reenactment customers, a few commercial customers, we sell a few to different Native American groups, and we've done a lot of movies. Dream Keeper, Into the West, Hidalgo, Peter Pan, Comanche Moon and more.

A tipi is much cheaper than a cabin and can get you out enjoying that lake-side or mountain property that you might not otherwise enjoy without some sort of shelter there.

[Bobc01]

I wake up to a teepee every morning, it's called morning glory or piss proud. :D

[hashbury]

Is there a big startup or setup fee to use ccbill.

[Beaver Bob]

Is there a big startup or setup fee to use ccbill.

no, signing up for CCBill is free. There is a $750 fee for visa.

[papagmp]

If you don't have the $750 for VISA, how the hell you gonna pay for the content, hosting, legal, etc.....

And since the majority of my members pay with VISA, it's a must - not an option.

We spend a few grand every month on "talent", a decent chunk on production costs (camera, editing, etc..) a few hundred on hosting, and that leaves precious little (nothing) for me.

Starting your own paysite is no cheap undertaking - I'm still on the investing phase of a 5-year business plan but things are on track and we expect to start seeing a return in the next few month. My total investment is well into the five-figures (closer to six) so it may take a while for me to see a full return on the investment but I'm in this for the long run not the weekly paycheck.

[Beaver Bob]

yea, if you can't afford the $750, you shouldn't even think of opening a paysite.

[hashbury]

I wasnt thinking of opening a porn site, I already work about 15 hours a day(Also dont think the wife would like the part about me having sex with other women).
Whats the reason for charging 750 take visa. I have a merchent account for adult novelty items and my setup fee was way less than 750

[Beaver Bob]

I wasnt thinking of opening a porn site, I already work about 15 hours a day(Also dont think the wife would like the part about me having sex with other women).
Whats the reason for charging 750 take visa. I have a merchent account for adult novelty items and my setup fee was way less than 750

adult paysites are considered high-risk and thats where they justify the charge. it sucks to have to pay but is really a pretty minor expense compared to everything else involved in running paysites.

[papagmp]

Whats the reason for charging 750 take visa. I have a merchent account for adult novelty items and my setup fee was way less than 750

Did you ever hear the story about why the dog licks his balls?

Because he CAN! |headbang|

[hashbury]

lol

[LeRoy]

Ok you guys...

Let me give you a touch of reality.

Papa's stories are great and that is why I am still here. Someone that old with such virility can be great a motivator. HEHEHE Luv you Papa

buuut. and this is a big but...

Please read CD34's post again and let that post absorb in your brain really good if you want to be an illustrious paysite owner.

Owning a paysite or a program is pure hell !!! I'm putting that in a nice way.

Sure having Jessica Valentino, Emilianna and Jasmine Tame coming to the door naked, flashing tittie or even asking"does my pussy look good?" is nice but.... who gives a shit about that when rent is due and hosting is over due :(

Getting the right traffic to the right niche would have been nice before I started my little program. Also your content provider should be on the up and up. I hear stories about mine being a used carsalesman "After" I spend 6 months designing sites geared toward exclusive content |banghead|

Anyway.... if you have traffic to your niche and web sites before you go into your program. You will be fine. If you are a newbie looking to start a porn paysite project dream. Stick with your freesites and "Converting sponsors".

Hence the siggy that has been feeding the fam :)

BTW I did get a sale from my program while posting but that's 29.95 in the last month. Oh yah and I'll be working as a cook at some dive bar till this shit gets better. My shift is football Sunday starting today and 3 nights during the weekdays |bullshit|

Sorry if I burst anyones bubble... but I just had to do it :( After reading T-Pat's post in the Blog section I thought I'd chime in somewhere.

[papagmp]

OK - I lied - or at least did something I don't normally do - I just "auditioned" one of the new girls that Diva brought by - it was her first three-some and it was a hell of a lot of fun! |bananna|

I didn't "finish" cuz I have a shoot in a few hours and I need to be able to "work" - both the girls finished though - so I guess that makes me a the looser :D

I have a "sister" shoot with a new petite baby-faced girl in 12 hours and another one with the newly "auditioned" girl on Monday.....









It's a tough job........... but somebody's got to do it

[Licker4U]

It's a tough job........... but somebody's got to do it

Let me know if you need a stunt double...|jester|

[papagmp]

Let me know if you need a stunt double...|jester|

Next time I have to fuck three girls on a motorcycle while jumping six burning buses I'll give you a call.... :D

[Licker4U]

Next time I have to fuck three girls on a motorcycle while jumping six burning buses I'll give you a call.... :D

Three girls? *perk*

[HowlingWulf]

Next time I have to fuck three girls on a motorcycle while jumping six burning buses I'll give you a call.... :D

NEXT time??? lol

[Licker4U]

NEXT time??? lol

Three didn't phase me a bit, Papa's the "Pussy Meister"! |bow|Papa

[horndog]

Starting your own paysite is no cheap undertaking - I'm still on the investing phase of a 5-year business plan but things are on track and we expect to start seeing a return in the next few month. My total investment is well into the five-figures (closer to six) so it may take a while for me to see a full return on the investment but I'm in this for the long run not the weekly paycheck.

How much money does it actually take to get a paysite started and up and running? If it cost $750 just for the Visa fee how much could someone end up spending on legal advice, camera equipment, modeling fees, and other unforeseen expenses? I'm just curious?


_________________
Clean Sites (http://www.the-xxx-haven.com/freesites/index.html)

[Star Man]

How much money does it actually take to get a paysite started and up and running? If it cost $750 just for the Visa fee how much could someone end up spending on legal advice, camera equipment, modeling fees, and other unforeseen expenses? I'm just curious?
I'm just guessing but if your doing gonzo/reality type stuff and your doing the fucking,directing,and editing on your own I bet it would be around 10 grand.Am I close |pimpin papagmp ?

[smutguy]

Great thread!!

[papagmp]

How much money does it actually take to get a paysite started and up and running? If it cost $750 just for the Visa fee how much could someone end up spending on legal advice, camera equipment, modeling fees, and other unforeseen expenses? I'm just curious?


I'm just guessing but if your doing gonzo/reality type stuff and your doing the fucking,directing,and editing on your own I bet it would be around 10 grand.Am I close |pimpin papagmp ?

There are a lot of variables - the biggest being the cost of talent.

My major cash expenses include (not in order):
Talent - over >$70K for my three sites so far (I have about 65% of our "shot" content on the sites right now.)
Recruiting - shit - can I write every trip to the titty bar off? I would gess that it's over $600.00 per month.
Legal (including 2257) - $9K
Editing - $6K (I do all the images myself and about 1/4th of the videos)
Programing - $8K (PHP database management) I do most of the HTML and graphic design)
Hosting - $300 plus per month
Photographers/Videographers - $30.00 to $150 per shoot
Testing (STD) - $150.00 per month (models pay for their their own but I have to pay for mine.
No-show - unrecoverable expenses created by models scheduling and not showing or rescheduling shoots - $200 per month on average.


Things that I do that you may have to pay for if you can't do it yourself:
Fucking Teenagers :D (I'll be happy to do this for you for a very reasonable fee)
Recruiting - can you really do it?
Graphic design (OK - maybe I should pay someone to do this |loony|)
Marketing - FS's galleries, banners, affiliate correspondence etc
HTML coding
Affiliate "Love"


Equipment costs:
Location - varies per shoot - I usually shoot at my home or in the woods - there is some risk involved in this in many locations.
Video Camera(s) - $4k
Still Camera(s) - $6K (including most of my lenses)
Video Lighting - $1.5K
Studio Lighting - $2K
Misc - tripods, light stands, soft boxes, reflectors, etc. $2K
Editing Software - Sony Vegas for three machines 1K
Computer(s) - we use four - 2.5K (mine was a lot more but it's older and not worth much now)


I had some of the equipment before I started into adult - and it's sure as hell possible to get by with less but it ain't the equipment costs that will make or break you.

Do the math and figure out how many memberships you have to sell in a month with 60% going to the affiliates and an additional chunk going to your processor - then look to see if you're already selling that many memberships...


|couch|

Every time I hear affiliates wining about how "filthy rich" program owners are - I have to laugh.....

[Star Man]

I didn't want to be rude and ask for specifics but I sure am glad you broke it down like this.Great Post papagmp!|thumb

[Beaver Bob]

papagmp's post is a realistic look at the expenses involved in running a paysite. excellent breakdown.

[horndog]

BTW, I wasn't trying to be rude by asking for some numbers, I just found this thread interesting. Starting a paysite defenitly sounds expensive though and seems like you need to be multi talented to pull it off. Anyway great post Papa thanks for the response and keep those hot Colorado Babes cumming. (lucky bastard). :D

[Star Man]

BTW, I wasn't trying to be rude by asking for some numbers, I just found this thread interesting.
Hell yeah it's interesting and specific numbers are handy.When I said 'I didn't want to be rude and ask for specifics' I wasn't trying to say in so many words "I didn't want to be rude and ask for specifics UNLIKE HORNDOG THE INCONSIDERATE ASSHOLE! " I can see how it could be read like that lol.

My personality translates horrible through text|loony| so sometimes I sound like a complete asshole,weird or over polite when I don't mean to be.

[Useless]

My personality translates horrible through text|loony| so sometimes I sound like a complete asshole...I have that same gift. :D

Don't forget, you don't have to deal directly with talent (which can be very off-putting) or purchase studio equipment in order to build a paysite. You could instead invest a fortune in fresh, quality content like Ramster does, rather successfully - and it doesn't require monthly STD exams. Preacher, who is a complete homo - not that there's anything wrong with that - owns CumHungry Pornstars (http://www.cumhungrypornstars.com/tour.html) and he didn't have to screw a single one of them (which is good because he's like SOOOOO gay).

[Beaver Bob]

I have that same gift. :D

Don't forget, you don't have to deal directly with talent (which can be very off-putting)

too fucking true. especially the ones that escort on the side, they will blow you off to go do another job all the while insisting they are "on their way over, will be there in a half hour", not worried about the fact that they are wasting your entire day.

[Star Man]

Both good points UW and BB.I started this thread simply because I didn't see the advantage of running a pay site as opposed to working with sponsors.I must admit,I like the direction this thread is taking though.Ipapagmp's cost breakdown post alone is a great reference for any one thinking about setting up a their own site.Even though I don't have any serious plans at this point,this thread at least got the creative gears in my drugged out delusional mind turning a bit.|juggle|

[papagmp]

too fucking true. especially the ones that escort on the side, they will blow you off to go do another job all the while insisting they are "on their way over, will be there in a half hour", not worried about the fact that they are wasting your entire day.

ROTFLMAO and crying at the same time. I should post the text messages here - you would be amazed at the shit they come up with.....

Seven of the last eight scheduled shoots were "no-shows" - I ran into two of the girls tonight - one was full of excuses and the other one is scheduled for tomorrow at four. Only time will tell.....

Interesting part is that on the one shoot that went off as scheduled one of the girls showed up with her "bouncer" - guess she didn't have any better calls that day. Actually, she is one of the few girl that has always been there as scheduled.

It was a great shoot - FFMM orgy with two of my old regulars (Tasha and Diva) and a guy that has worked for Kink (Men in Pain) and is going to do some work with Vivid next month. It was a little weird for him to not be tied up..... but it was awesome to work with a gut that can get it up and finish on time. And anyone that's ever worked in a hottub scene knows what 104 degree water can do to a hard dick.

Expect to see this one on Real Colorado Girls soon... and no, I don't let anyone tie me up - especially Tasha!

[papagmp]

I have that same gift. :D

Don't forget, you don't have to deal directly with talent (which can be very off-putting) or purchase studio equipment in order to build a paysite. You could instead invest a fortune in fresh, quality content like Ramster does, rather successfully - and it doesn't require monthly STD exams. Preacher, who is a complete homo - not that there's anything wrong with that - owns CumHungry Pornstars (http://www.cumhungrypornstars.com/tour.html) and he didn't have to screw a single one of them (which is good because he's like SOOOOO gay).

Soooooo true. The girls at the county health department know me pretty darn well - and none of them are cute.

And if Preacher is really SOOOOO gay, then at least he's faithful to you - cuz try as I might, I couldn't get him up to my room in Vegas - and I even spend a shitlaod on a nice dinner and drinks -- and all I got to do was kiss his sexy bald head - I think he's just a frickin tease....

[Beaver Bob]

ROTFLMAO and crying at the same time. I should post the text messages here - you would be amazed at the shit they come up with.....


Its amazing how some talent have absolutely no consideration for other peoples time. If they really want to ditch our gig and do something else, i'd much rather them just say that then feed the typical 'oh i'm on my way' bullshit. At least tell me you aren't coming so I can move on and do something else.

We had a week last month where 4 out of the 6 scheduled talent flaked completely.

[papagmp]

BTW, I wasn't trying to be rude by asking for some numbers, I just found this thread interesting. Starting a paysite defenitly sounds expensive though and seems like you need to be multi talented to pull it off. Anyway great post Papa thanks for the response and keep those hot Colorado Babes cumming. (lucky bastard). :D

No problem - As I think back, if someone had told me what I know now, I would have done a lot of things differently - hindsight is always 20-20 and no question is a stupid question IMO.

[Maj. Stress]

ROTFLMAO and crying at the same time. I should post the text messages here - you would be amazed at the shit they come up with.....

Seven of the last eight scheduled shoots were "no-shows" - I ran into two of the girls tonight - one was full of excuses and the other one is scheduled for tomorrow at four. Only time will tell.....

Interesting part is that on the one shoot that went off as scheduled one of the girls showed up with her "bouncer" - guess she didn't have any better calls that day. Actually, she is one of the few girl that has always been there as scheduled.

It was a great shoot - FFMM orgy with two of my old regulars (Tasha and Diva) and a guy that has worked for Kink (Men in Pain) and is going to do some work with Vivid next month. It was a little weird for him to not be tied up..... but it was awesome to work with a gut that can get it up and finish on time. And anyone that's ever worked in a hottub scene knows what 104 degree water can do to a hard dick.

Expect to see this one on Real Colorado Girls soon... and no, I don't let anyone tie me up - especially Tasha!
Come on, admit it already, YOU love what Tasha does to men when she ties them up. |ohhhhh|

[papagmp]

Come on, admit it already, YOU love what Tasha does to men when she ties them up. |ohhhhh|

Sure - as long as it's YOU that's tied up :D

I'll have her bring the BIG strap-on for you.........

[tigermom]

I guess it takes a special kind of person to work in production. Could have never done it myself. Don't you ever get bored from seeing/having sex with so many strange women? Especially when they're teenagers, bleh. If I had to spend so much time with teenagers, I'd be selling the business asap. Amazing to see all of the guys drooling over this thread, when personally, you'll have to pay me heaps of money to be on the production side of any pornsite, even a gay hunks site:D

[papagmp]

Don't you ever get bored from seeing/having sex with so many strange women? Especially when they're teenagers

Now come on Tigermom - we've had this conversation before .......


You want the short answer?






NO!










Especially BECAUSE they are teenagers |headbang|

[tigermom]

I know about you, darling. I was wondering about the other people posting to the thread.