View Full Version : So ARS is collecting photo IDs for ePassporte
tickler
2006-02-23, 04:02 AM
Starting today we will be asking all webmasters using or applying for epassporte as a payment method to fax in a copy of your government issued photo ID showing an address, or government issued passport. Current webmasters can fax in a copy of their ID to1.866.316.9640 before or on March 10th. Make sure you include your account number. After March 10th, all accounts that do not verify this information will be automatically switched to receive a standard check payout method. Make sure all your account details are up to date.
After all the privacy concerns raised over 2257 and Google and Dubyahs spying, you would think some companies might have gotten the ideal that the mass collection of personal data is a no-no.|crazy|
I don't even supply that kind of information to companies that I work for, let alone Amex, MC, Visa, Discover.
Surfn
2006-02-23, 04:13 AM
They will lose most of their whales with this latest move. :D
I tried to switch from check to ePassporte a couple of times but never got a response from ARS. So with even more (useless) rules I'll just stick by plain checks.
Greenguy
2006-02-23, 07:15 AM
After all the privacy concerns raised over 2257 and Google and Dubyahs spying, you would think some companies might have gotten the ideal that the mass collection of personal data is a no-no.|crazy|...So you're upset that they will now have a picture of you to go along with your name, address, SS/TaxID number, etc....which they already have?
Anyone remember the old AVS/Processor Validate? I had to fax them a copy of my license back in 97 in order to get paid. Big deal.
Ramster
2006-02-23, 07:20 AM
I agree that they already have ALL of our information already so a picture is really not a big deal. But I also agree that having to send in a photo is stupid. Hey ARS, you already have everything there is to know about us, name, our address, tax ID if American, ect.
I am kind of confused by this move. It doesn't seem to have anything to do with them having your picture, they just want to make sure that you are who you say your are. If it is for US tax purposes, it is even stranger since ePassporte uses offshore banks for transactions. They have probably been burned by fake US TINs for the IRS. It used to be a $20 per wrong TIN with the IRS and maybe they changed it now. Who knows???
GonZo
2006-02-23, 08:43 AM
I dont have to worry about it. They have deleted my account.
Dr Bizzaro
2006-02-23, 10:22 AM
They have my business info, not my personal info. I don't give my home address to ANYONE I do business with.
(Unless it happens to be a friend.)
Think I'll be switching back to a check......
OK here is my pic
Have you done something with your hair? It looks different.
Greenguy
2006-02-23, 11:07 AM
They have my business info, not my personal info. I don't give my home address to ANYONE I do business with....Is your ePass in your name or the company name?
If it's in the company name, then that does bring up a good question. Your personal photo ID isn't what you'd use to prove that your company is legit. Maybe a copy of the Fed Tax ID paperwork would do?
PR_Tom
2006-02-23, 11:21 AM
I believe they want to see primarily the address on the ID.
I believe they want to see primarily the address on the ID.
Yeah, that's what I am thinking too. I don't think a picture has anything to do with it.
JoeBlack
2006-02-23, 02:41 PM
Call me paranoid but that is just to much for me.
If I was an unethical person and some how got access to all of that info I could make a shit load of fake identities. I could get a birth certificate an open up a number of accounts and loans under another name.
Yeah im just paranoid :)
This is a list of the info they will have :
Full Name
Home Address
Social Security
Phone Number
With license
Drivers License ID
Date of Birth
As of recent if you got a new license
A Digital Signature at the bottom right corner
Easy access to learning how to rewriting your name |angry|
My own mother doesnt even have all of this info so why would I hand it over to a big company who im not sure have control over all of there workers. There are sponsor companies out there who fire people everyday and all it would take is for one person to get that information and sell it to someone out there. I have a problem even giving my SS let alone the rest of the info.
So in short I will stick to my checks thank you very much :D
digifan
2006-02-23, 02:49 PM
They will lose most of their whales with this latest move. :D
And they deserve it |thumb |satan| |spook |nahnah|
digifan
2006-02-23, 02:51 PM
OK here is my pic
Love it hon |jester| :D
Call me paranoid but that is just to much for me.
If I was an unethical person and some how got access to all of that info I could make a shit load of fake identities. I could get a birth certificate an open up a number of accounts and loans under another name.
Yeah im just paranoid :)
This is a list of the info they will have :
Full Name
Home Address
Social Security
Phone Number
With license
Drivers License ID
Date of Birth
As of recent if you got a new license
A Digital Signature at the bottom right corner
Easy access to learning how to rewriting your name |angry|
My own mother doesnt even have all of this info so why would I hand it over to a big company who im not sure have control over all of there workers. There are sponsor companies out there who fire people everyday and all it would take is for one person to get that information and sell it to someone out there. I have a problem even giving my SS let alone the rest of the info.
So in short I will stick to my checks thank you very much :D
If you are using a SSN, any program with it could steal your identity right now. Most people that ask for a driver's license number just use it for your security when there is a problem. I have 6 credit cards now. All with phoney driver's license numbers :) Really because I have everything else memorized and I don't want to pull out my license.
gideon
2006-02-23, 03:36 PM
ARS will make exceptions for its WHALES,(read: spammers and cheaters), they always do.
I can promise you they will not get my ID. I make sure that I have atleast 5 different addresses, numerous IPs, and WiFi connections and I stay pretty busy with travelling so that if, err WHEN, the Bush/PNAC (http://www.newamericancentury.org/)/NeoKoNazi's come for me I will be nowhere and everywhere..
Peace,
- Gideon
DISCLAIMER: I know not all the Whales are cheaters and spammers but you go to almost any affiliate program and the top dollar dogs usually fit a typical profile
PR_Tom
2006-02-23, 03:43 PM
Big whales are more likely to be typein, review site, PPC I'd say.
Anyway they've said on other boards that you can black out ss#'s, DL#'s etc etc. Has anyone ICQ'd them to please come check the board?
If it weeds out fraud, it's good for every sponsor. Heck I'll paste this thread to someone.
Toolz
2006-02-23, 03:52 PM
We have had a problem with a large amount of fraudulent Epassporte accounts feel free to blockout your dl #, SS#, etc, we're comparing addresses on accounts to addresses on ID's for those webmaster choosing to be paid by Epassporte.
Jim: Yes copy of something from the government with your corp tax ID will be fine for corporations
Surfn: Um no, most whales don't care how their paid and accept checks.
Gideon: Thanks for the kind words we love you too
Again this is ONLY if you want Epassporte, we don't require ID for any other payment method, however as basically 1099 contractors earning thousands of dollars I find it funny that everyone questions our wanting to know who does biz with us.
EvilFubAr
2006-02-23, 03:55 PM
I agree that they already have ALL of our information already so a picture is really not a big deal. But I also agree that having to send in a photo is stupid. Hey ARS, you already have everything there is to know about us, name, our address, tax ID if American, ect.
This is true, however we need to verify that what you entered is true information. We are not just looking for a photo of you, we need to verify your ID card or any information that matches your account details.
We know most of you are not scammers, but we need to have a filter in place. If this is in any way a problem for you please contact me or any ARS rep and we can work through a way to verify your information.
If you have a Buisness account we simple need to see a copy of Federal Tax ID paperwork.
ICQ 27236459
Not really a big deal. I have Photoshop and know how to use it.
Greenguy
2006-02-23, 03:59 PM
Toolz - I'm with you on this one.
People seem to forget that we are ALL Independent Contractors & if you walked into the ARS office today & got a job as an Independent Contractor, you'd be filling out forms (W9) & they'd be making copies of your driver's license & SS card.
PR_Tom
2006-02-23, 04:05 PM
Not really a big deal. I have Photoshop and know how to use it.
I'm not sure why but this post made me laugh so much that I choked on my chex mix, lol.
Sorry no pics
We have had a problem with a large amount of fraudulent Epassporte accounts feel free to blockout your dl #, SS#, etc, we're comparing addresses on accounts to addresses on ID's for those webmaster choosing to be paid by Epassporte.
Jim: Yes copy of something from the government with your corp tax ID will be fine for corporations
Surfn: Um no, most whales don't care how their paid and accept checks.
Gideon: Thanks for the kind words we love you too
Again this is ONLY if you want Epassporte, we don't require ID for any other payment method, however as basically 1099 contractors earning thousands of dollars I find it funny that everyone questions our wanting to know who does biz with us.
I just don't get it toolz, ePassporte is offshore. Why do you guys give a rat's ass?
But, I am more curious than anything else. If you want to make sure you are doing business with who they say they are, that's fine by me.
But still...my above question :)
On a more serious note…
I'm a corporation so I don't ever have to give out my personal information and don't have any problem with showing my corp papers to anyone that I do biz with.
But what kind of fraudulent activity can someone do with getting paid by ePassporte? I mean I log into my account and tell someone to pay me to my ePassporte account. What am I missing here? Besides saying send my payment to this account what else could I do?
Greenguy
2006-02-23, 04:19 PM
I'm betting that some fraud or excessive chargebacks or something along those lines was found AFTER a webmaster was paid via ePassporte & they can't get the money back.
This is not a big deal - just because we work on the internet does not mean that everything has to have this anonymous feel to it.
Like I said, if you worked in the ARS offices (or any other sponsor for that matter) they'd have all this info already.
Toolz
2006-02-23, 05:57 PM
Jim,
GG hit the nail on the head. I don't really want to go into details on a public forum as it's a large ongoing investigation but let's just say there was some not too nice activities occuring across a multitude of Epassporte accounts. While it's true I don't really care how/what webmasters do with their money once we send it to them be it offshore corps, etc that's their problem, but when they utilize an offshore anonymous entity to defraud the program that's whole other game.
Toolz
2006-02-23, 05:59 PM
On a more serious note…
I'm a corporation so I don't ever have to give out my personal information and don't have any problem with showing my corp papers to anyone that I do biz with.
But what kind of fraudulent activity can someone do with getting paid by ePassporte? I mean I log into my account and tell someone to pay me to my ePassporte account. What am I missing here? Besides saying send my payment to this account what else could I do?
Cleo, again don't really want to let the cat outta the bag how we caught this but it's not hard to have multiple epassporte accounts... see where I'm going with this?
Toolz
2006-02-23, 06:01 PM
Like I said, if you worked in the ARS offices (or any other sponsor for that matter) they'd have all this info already.
Correct, in this case unfortunately when you tried and weed out the bad seeds you have to inconvenience all of those using the system, but just think of all the time you save every week from visiting the bank ;)
...just think of all the time you save every week from visiting the bank ;)But I like to flirt with the girls at the bank. :D
I think this is a relatively right decision, but I think better strict the original ePassporte verification. I hate the carders and money targeted hackers.
MrYum
2006-02-23, 08:43 PM
I don't use epass with ARS, but would have no problem giving this kind of info to any reputable sponsor.
Agree with Greenie...this is a no big deal thing to me.
emmanuelle
2006-02-23, 08:59 PM
I don't really see any problem with this. They are in the unfortunate position of dealing with people who hold multiple accounts. This puts them at risk of violating Patriot Act rules concerning money laundering.
I can't so much as send a $500 wire to Russia (from Canada) without a NYC bank calling me to verify why I am sending it thanks to these rules. And yes, photo id is required despite my bank having my blood type, shoe size and satellite photos of my last 3 boyfriend's homes.
By covering their own ass, they are proving to us that they are serious about their longevity and commitment to our industry.
Mr. Blue
2006-02-23, 10:35 PM
I don't use ARS, but it's pretty much the standard flow of how the adult biz works. Scammers find a loophole to cheat the system, someone finds out, new rules are put into place to stop the scam. Unfortunately honest webmasters get grouped in with the cheaters when the new rules get put into place.
I don't really blame ARS for taking steps to prevent whatever cheating is occurring. Also, if you don't want to put your id on, just get a check instead...it doesn't seem like a biggie to me.
Moral of the story: Cheaters suck and they make it inconvenient for everyone.
blazi
2006-02-24, 07:45 AM
at least they gave us a couple weeks warning
Jim,
GG hit the nail on the head. I don't really want to go into details on a public forum as it's a large ongoing investigation but let's just say there was some not too nice activities occuring across a multitude of Epassporte accounts. While it's true I don't really care how/what webmasters do with their money once we send it to them be it offshore corps, etc that's their problem, but when they utilize an offshore anonymous entity to defraud the program that's whole other game.
I get it now...
I was thinking tax problems or the like.
gregtx
2006-02-24, 12:51 PM
I can totally see how tax issues would be a major problem.. we've been hit with some pretty hefty fines.. b/c tax ids no longer match a paid to...
I can totally see how tax issues would be a major problem.. we've been hit with some pretty hefty fines.. b/c tax ids no longer match a paid to...
Me too :) When I had Ultracash, I wanted to report paying foreign webmasters. Our software spit out 1099s for everyone and put all "0s" for non US webmasters. I sent them to the IRS and they fined me $20 for each one. It ended up being over a $20k fine. The thing is, before they let me know, it was another time for taxes and I did it again (not knowing it was wrong). They never did or said anything about them. I guess it just depends on who or what is doing the 1099s on any particular day. :)
gregtx
2006-02-24, 01:07 PM
Me too :) When I had Ultracash, I wanted to report paying foreign webmasters. Our software spit out 1099s for everyone and put all "0s" for non US webmasters. I sent them to the IRS and they fined me $20 for each one. It ended up being over a $20k fine. The thing is, before they let me know, it was another time for taxes and I did it again (not knowing it was wrong). They never did or said anything about them. I guess it just depends on who or what is doing the 1099s on any particular day. :)
i'm having dejavu... except .. the $20 each was on US webmasters!!!
now we constantly have people updating their pay to info to some foreign entity.. and then wonder why we have to hold payment b/c their old tax id gets kicked back by the irs... for a no longer working tax id... I think there are lots of people getting bad tax advice from friends and boards.. not realizing that just moving their company offshore.. does not let them not pay US taxes.. ifthey still live here...
Toolz
2006-02-24, 01:28 PM
i'm having dejavu... except .. the $20 each was on US webmasters!!!
now we constantly have people updating their pay to info to some foreign entity.. and then wonder why we have to hold payment b/c their old tax id gets kicked back by the irs... for a no longer working tax id... I think there are lots of people getting bad tax advice from friends and boards.. not realizing that just moving their company offshore.. does not let them not pay US taxes.. ifthey still live here...
LOL yeah I'm not sure where everyone got this idea that you didn't have to pay taxes if you just created offshore corps everything would be fine and dandy, yeah, that works great if you MOVE offshore and don't plan on coming back.
DJilla
2006-02-25, 01:08 AM
Actually there is a way for US companies to avoid taxes on foreign generated revenue from a subsidary corp registered in a foreign country, they still have to be reported but there is a structuring method that reduces them significantly though I doubt most making the move are doing it properly...
gregtx
2006-02-28, 02:04 PM
Actually there is a way for US companies to avoid taxes on foreign generated revenue from a subsidary corp registered in a foreign country, they still have to be reported but there is a structuring method that reduces them significantly though I doubt most making the move are doing it properly...
avoid? or defer???
LOL yeah I'm not sure where everyone got this idea that you didn't have to pay taxes if you just created offshore corps everything would be fine and dandy, yeah, that works great if you MOVE offshore and don't plan on coming back.
That's correct...but if a sponsor is from out of the US and is paying you through an offshore bank, you are basically running a cash business, right?
So, like any other cash business, you need to report that cash you receive :) Kind of like tips if you are a waiter :) Or the guy down the street from me that I buy motorcycle parts from. For some reason, if I pay him cash, the price is cheaper and I get no receipt :) But I know he must be reporting that income ;)
i'm having dejavu... except .. the $20 each was on US webmasters!!!
now we constantly have people updating their pay to info to some foreign entity.. and then wonder why we have to hold payment b/c their old tax id gets kicked back by the irs... for a no longer working tax id... I think there are lots of people getting bad tax advice from friends and boards.. not realizing that just moving their company offshore.. does not let them not pay US taxes.. ifthey still live here...
It got much worse for me. My accountant contacted the IRS and assured them that we would be sending corrected 1099s. So again, I heard nothing from the IRS until it was too late. I paid the accountant for the new 1099s but they failed to send them to the IRS. The accountant said he did, the IRS said they never received them so...I was screwed twice.
DJilla
2006-03-01, 09:24 AM
avoid? or defer???
Well neither really, you still pay taxes to your local authority, you're just not subject to US Corp taxes. I shouldn't have mentioned it, its off topic anyway. Also, its not an easy thing to do either. You have to have foriegn agents, and officers, and you'd still pay US taxes on dividends received which is how the revenue is paid out. Bottom line just pay your reasonable taxes. People scamming are just asking for trouble and in this ever increasing electronic world you're likely to get caught. Stick to the old rules... CASH IS KING |thumb
Kenny B!
2006-03-02, 05:39 PM
This is a fraud prevention measure and if it became an industry wide practice then it would benifit everyone long term.
If you can't prove you are who you say you are then something ain't right.
MonsterPartners
2006-03-03, 09:35 AM
I could never understand why people got so upset by this. You want someone to pay you thousands of dollars, well, what is wrong with them verifying you are who you claim to be?
Linkster
2006-03-03, 02:14 PM
It still amazes me how many affiliate companies out there still file 1099s in violation of the IRS rules when they are paying a corporation instead of a person - and either just havent been audited yet or are just waiting for that needless filing fine thats gonna get levied on them. Sure seems like a waste of money and time to me
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